Talkback: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla (2002)

[HedorahIsBestGirl]

I legit think the bluescreen effects look way better than the ones in GMK, by a mile. Godzilla emerging out of the harbor looked particularly bad to my eyes. In comparison to the various composite shots in Godzilla's rampage in the rain in this movie, I felt that was damn near life like.

I disagree. I think Godzilla's emergence in this one screams "bluscreen" far more than in GMK. Some of the composite shots during his subsequent rampage hold up well but there are a few where the lighting on the actors is glaringly different than the lighting on Godzilla.

Kou Otani's score is pretty good, "better" one can say. I don't think its as memorable though.

Obviously this one's a matter of opinion; I can't vividly remember any of GxMG's scores except the Godzilla theme, which is a carryover from Megaguirus. I know most fans are far more enraptured with Oshima's music than I am. I've always thought they sound nice but don't stick in my head the way scores from Ifukube/Sato/Otani do.

[Legion1979]

I legit think the bluescreen effects look way better than the ones in GMK, by a mile. Godzilla emerging out of the harbor looked particularly bad to my eyes. In comparison to the various composite shots in Godzilla's rampage in the rain in this movie, I felt that was damn near life like.

I disagree. I think Godzilla's emergence in this one screams "bluscreen" far more than in GMK. Some of the composite shots during his subsequent rampage hold up well but there are a few where the lighting on the actors is glaringly different than the lighting on Godzilla.

Man, I'm sorry but Godzilla's entrance in GMK is terrible. The boat dropping toward the camera with the man's screaming face clearly visible looks ridiculous. Then that cut to Godzilla knee deep in the bay that couldn't possibly be deep enough for him to submerge in is just as terrible. Every decent effect in GMK in undermined by something that makes me cringe, and a lot of thar involves the Godzilla suit.

Perhaps Godzilla's entrance in GxMG isn't perfect, but him rising up behind the reporter with his theme suddenly starting is really damn cool.

[G-Matt]

Happy 20th Anniversary to my favorite Millennium movie (December 14th)!

[LegendZilla]

I think that the Toho's decision to call this incarnation of MechaG Kiryu stemmed from a subconscious desire to make a new monster for Godzilla to fight. However, they new it won't be profitable so they swapped a new name onto a pre-existing one and the rest is history. Does my theory have merit?

[edgaguirus]

Kiryu means dragon, so it fits a robot that looks like a bipedal dragon.

[G-Matt]

Kiryu means dragon, so it fits a robot that looks like a bipedal dragon.

More specifically, "ryu" translates to dragon. Kiryu basically stands for "Machine Dragon".

[Dv-218]

I don’t buy that tbh, if that were the case they would have just slapped a new copyright stamp on him ala Monster X/Keizer Ghidorah- however, he is evidently still considered MG legally. “Kiryu” is just a militaristic in-universe codename for the project and nothing more.

[LSD Jellyfish]

Kiryu is very obviously a name given to start differentiating the MG incarnations. I almost garuntee that future MG incarnations, that aren't 10 minute cameos like MV and City, and RP1, will have individualized names. Remember that the Millenium Series is mostly a Western Fan term. It would be confusing to talk about the Heisei MG in that context.

[Legion1979]

Wait what's going on here? Everyone in the two Millennium MG films calls rhe robot Kiryu. Everyone. It's officially another Mechagodzilla, the character's true name in these two films is Kiryu.

[LSD Jellyfish]

Wait what's going on here? Everyone in the two Millennium MG films calls rhe robot Kiryu. Everyone. It's officially another Mechagodzilla, the character's true name in these two films is Kiryu.

Confused and bizare pesudospeculation leading to rebuttal.

It's pretty obvious for everyone else why they called it Kiryu.

[LegendZilla]

^If they wanted to give help Kiryu be separate from other incarnations of MG, why not give every new version of Godzilla, Mothra or Ghidorah a completely different name too?

[LSD Jellyfish]

^If they wanted to give help Kiryu be separate from other incarnations of MG, why not give every new version of Godzilla, Mothra or Ghidorah a completely different name too?

What even is there to say at this point... I'm confused why any of this is an issue for you. Kiryu is Mechagodzilla. It's copyrighted as such. Figures of that incarnation are generally sold as "Mechagodzilla 2002" or "Mechagodzilla 2003". In the film they refer to it as Kiryu, because it's a weapon and people like giving names to things. It was obviously an intentional way to help fans and people refer to different MGs seperately. Instead you tried to extrapolate some weirdness of there being some other monster or something.

And actually, very recently they have started doing just that. Godzilla Earth, Godzilla Filius, Godzilla Ultima...Mothra Leo...

Another good example, would be Toto. Toto is Gamera, but obviously that doesn't mean Daiei "subconciously" wanted to make TOTO the GIANT SQUID movie or some bs.

[JAGzilla]

I don't know if Legend's theory is completely wrong. Altering an existing, profitable character rather than take the financial risk of creating a new one is something that happens all the time. The superhero genre, in particular, is becoming known for that. Creating a new black or bisexual hero may or may not work out, but people are going to pay to see Spider-Man no matter what.

Do we know for sure that Kiryu didn't start life as an original DNA computer based monster before being reworked into the safe bet Mechagodzilla?

[edgaguirus]

Unless there's a book or article that reveals such information about this, we'll likely not know.

Anyways, it's a nice way to differentiate this version of MG from others.

[HeiseiGodzilla117]

I rewatched this for the first time in a while today. It has really grown on me. I still think the Godzilla suit looks kind of stiff. But there are some really great moments in this movie. The characters are fairly engaging. I also don't think I ever noticed before that the title card starts out as "Gojira x Gojira" before changing the latter part of the title to "MekaGojira." That's a nice touch.

[shadowgigan]

Kiryu is very obviously a name given to start differentiating the MG incarnations. I almost garuntee that future MG incarnations, that aren't 10 minute cameos like MV and City, and RP1, will have individualized names. Remember that the Millenium Series is mostly a Western Fan term. It would be confusing to talk about the Heisei MG in that context.

I think it also makes it more personable, somehow.

[Legion1979]

I think it's hilarious that the Kiryu team's training consists of running, climbing walls, crawling under barbed wire and wading through rivers.

Guys...you're going to be piloting a robot and fighting a radioactive, beam spitting monster. How is that training supposed to help you?

[SpiderZilla]

I think it's hilarious that the Kiryu team's training consists of running, climbing walls, crawling under barbed wire and wading through rivers.

Guys...you're going to be piloting a robot and fighting a radioactive, beam spitting monster. How is that training supposed to help you?

Given that the battles might go on for hours, I presume that the training builds up their physical and mental endurance. It probably also improves their reflexes and alertness. And if nothing else they never know when they’ll be required to dash across a battlefield to climb into the cockpit inside Kiryu.

[JAGzilla]

I think it's hilarious that the Kiryu team's training consists of running, climbing walls, crawling under barbed wire and wading through rivers.

Guys...you're going to be piloting a robot and fighting a radioactive, beam spitting monster. How is that training supposed to help you?

Given that the battles might go on for hours, I presume that the training builds up their physical and mental endurance. It probably also improves their reflexes and alertness. And if nothing else they never know when they’ll be required to dash across a battlefield to climb into the cockpit inside Kiryu.

Exactly. Tank crews and fighter pilots still go through basic training to teach them standard military skills and enable them to function and survive if they have to operate outside of their vehicle for whatever reason. The specialist skills of a mecha pilot are presumably very expensive for the government to teach and maintain. They have strong incentive to give that valuable asset every tool possible to stay alive and operational.

[LSD Jellyfish]

In Godzilla vs. Megagurius, the training pays off when Tsujimori is stranded at sea with Godzilla, and has to physically climb onto him in an incredibly intense circumstance. I recall later in the film she parachutes out of the Gryphon to land in a pool? That's a different film, but it shows that anyone involved in fighting Godzilla has to be prepared for pretty much any scenario. I used to question why they had training montages in Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla (1992), but in retrospect it all makes a lot of sense.

Jagzilla alluded to it, but there's also a possibility that someone might and try to overtake the Mechaunit and gain control of it. That's why its important for pilots to be physically able and at peak performance, despite that not being whatever is important

Of course, that's just based on "reality" and provides a rationale for them having to undergo training. But narratively, the function is obvious; Training in films signals growth, commitment, and in specific cases team work. I mentioned Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla (1992) before, but that's a good example because Aoki fails pretty badly during his training. It is kinda well known he isn't committed, and right when he's needed he isn't there and is booted off the pilot team.