Goro Maki and the Origins of Shin Godzilla!

[LSD Jellyfish]

Hello, recently obtained a copy of the Art of Shin Godzilla book. While many people are aware of the book, I haven't seen any of this posted or talked about. The book goes into meticulous detail into pretty much everything, including layouts of all the meeting rooms. As a result, it seems like this was created to answer Shin Godzilla's origins, and the mystery of Goro Maki. I would not consider this part of the film, but it's interesting none the less. Note that this is not a jape, and it's in English, I'm assuming, to add to the realism.









The main interesting thing is that Shin was/is originally an ichthyosaur, or very similar type of creature! Lot's of little interesting bits to dissect here.

Note that this can later be merged with the general shin Thread but I haven't seen people talk about this so I wanted to make it well known.

[Jetty_Jags]

Thats actually really cool. Thanks for posting this.

It would also be cool if one of the more paleontologically knowledgeable users were to verify the accuracy of these statements? It doesn't really matter I'm just curious.

[LSD Jellyfish]

Thats actually really cool. Thanks for posting this.

It would also be cool if one of the more paleontologically knowledgeable users were to verify the accuracy of these statements? It doesn't really matter I'm just curious.

I'll post it in the paleontology thread.

Also, what's cool about is that it subtly foreshadows Godzilla's transformations. It talks about these creatures/Godzilla having a "bird like body"/skeletal structure, but not yet walking upright because they haven't been on land. Sure enough, Godzilla goes on land, and in a matter of days develops an upright posture. It's almost as though Shin Godzilla is continually mutating/evolving itself in an asexual fashion. Shin Godzilla goes through millions of years of evolution in a short span. I wonder if the whole wings thing may be the part of that trajectory.

The mention of the birth canal, may also be a reference to how Sin presumably reproduces (live young, not eggs).

[SoggyNoodles2016]

This is a great find, LSD!

I'm kind of an amaetur paleontology wise, but I do know a lot of this stuff, given it's some of the most agreed on stuff/follow MUCH more knowledgable people lol.

So, this is mostly really accurate. Marine reptiles are basically as described with live birth and being aquaticly adapted with some traces of orginal life, all the stuf about dinosaurs is right (can't believe a Godzilla film actually explained Ornithosuchia) and other stuff like that.

Minus a few grammatical errors, there's only a few MINOR errors I'd mention.

1. The sheet doesn't make it clear but the marine reptiles of the Paleozoic weren't ichtyosaurs, plesiosaurs and so on. They were mainly small aquatic lizard like creatures. They either died out or evolved into the mentioned ones.

2. Icthyosaurs are not dinosaurs. They ALMOST had this, only to suddenly switch to saying they were at the end. Marine reptiles have no evolutionary relation to dinosaurs. They're more closely related to modern reptiles (the mosasaurs are in the same family as snakes and moniter lizards) or extinct lineages then dinosaurs trees. I feel like this might have been handwaving for how dinosaury Shin is though.

I could see Shin as an Icthyosaur, though one who evolved though the years obviously.

[Jetty_Jags]

Thanks, I was a little confused when they used the three points to call an Ichtyosaur dinosaur, when one of the points was land dwelling. But I'll take it.

[LSD Jellyfish]

So I'm looking at the fake social security thing, and there's a few easter eggs:
Odoshima is Odo Island! Goro Maki was Born there.

The address listed just brings up a place in kanagawa. I searched some random dates listed (todays date, and his birthday) and I couldn't find much,

[Terasawa]

It doesn't surprise me that he taught at Jonan University.

^Wasn't the Odo Island thing revealed in the movie?

[LSD Jellyfish]

It doesn't surprise me that he taught at Jonan University.

^Wasn't the Odo Island thing revealed in the movie?

Oh yeah I guess I forgot.

I think Teito University is a long running Japanese joke for a non-existing but prestigious university.
http://janneinosaka.blogspot.com/2009/0 ... inbun.html

I was thinking about this more, and I wonder if these documents did appear in the film for a few seconds or were unreadable. A lot of films have props or fake newspapers that have real writing on them but usually don't mean much.

[Terasawa]

I think Teito University is a long running Japanese joke for a non-existing but prestigious university.
http://janneinosaka.blogspot.com/2009/0 ... inbun.html

Interesting. I didn't know about this one. Jonan University is, I think, the invention of Shotaro Ishinomori or Toei. It's featured in a few of the Kamen Rider shows and has also crossed over to other series.

[tbeasley]

Not to burst anyone's bubble but this had been shared before. It doesn't give any concrete answers exactly, there's still a lot of mystery behind Maki's connection with Godzilla, but it pretty much states that Godzilla did begin life as some sort of prehistoric marine reptile-type thing.

Here's an interview with the guy who helped translate some of the English language documents for the film, some featured in the Art of Shin Godzilla - http://www.scifijapan.com/articles/2020 ... o-higuchi/

[Chrispy_G]

Oh man I love additional materials like this, especially for Godzilla films.

[Gawdziller1954]

Hello, recently obtained a copy of the Art of Shin Godzilla book. While many people are aware of the book, I haven't seen any of this posted or talked about. The book goes into meticulous detail into pretty much everything, including layouts of all the meeting rooms. As a result, it seems like this was created to answer Shin Godzilla's origins, and the mystery of Goro Maki. I would not consider this part of the film, but it's interesting none the less. Note that this is not a jape, and it's in English, I'm assuming, to add to the realism.









The main interesting thing is that Shin was/is originally an ichthyosaur, or very similar type of creature! Lot's of little interesting bits to dissect here.

Note that this can later be merged with the general shin Thread but I haven't seen people talk about this so I wanted to make it well known.

I have the book as well and saw this in early 2017. My take on it is that Shin Godzilla is a highly evolved Mosasaur for 3 reasons:
1) Of all large Mesozoic marine reptiles Mosasaurs are the most recent in terms of evolution and date. Mosasaurs replaced Pliosaurs and Ichthyosaurs in the early cretaceous, after having evolved from a land-dwelling ancestor. They were also the most advanced marine reptiles. It would make the most sense that the most advanced and well evolved marine reptiles, which survived the latest, would have an advanced deep water form that survived the end of the dinosaurs.
2) Mosasaurs already show evolutionary forms that tended toward deep water or murky water visibility-Gorynosaurus is one such form. Shin's 1st and 2nd form show an elongate body, with long tail for propulsion, a bulky but elongate head, and a whale-like cross section. This agrees with forms like Gorynosaurus and other mosasaurs such as Mosasaurus itself.
3) The bite marks on the barrels betray an animal that has a wide, wedge shaped head and sharp teeth. Guess what large marine reptile has this headshape?

[ShinGojira14]

I know a great deal about dinosaurs and prehistoric animals, so here I go with the criticisms:

A: Icthyosaurs, Plesiosaurs, and Mosasaurs are not dinosaurs. They are prehistoric reptiles, yes (pterosaurs even being of the archosaur family, same as dinosaurs), but they are not dinosaurs. Regardless of their size or pelvic bones. Paleontologists know this.

B: The Permian Period is of the Paleozoic era, not the Mesozoic era. It was the final stage in that era before the beginning of the Triassic, in which the Mesozoic era began.


I'm starting to see why Goro Maki may have gotten expelled.


Also C: Goro never states Godzilla was an Ichthyosaur. He goes over certain anatomy of Icthyosaurs- just as he does with other prehistoric reptiles. But he never states exactly what Godzilla really is in his essay here- which I like, because it keeps a layer of mystery to Big G's origins. Plus, Goro proposing the theory that Godzilla is a prehistoric oceanic reptile mutated by radiation actually links as a reference to the 1954 film. For all intents and purposes, Reiwa Godzilla's origin story is almost identical to that of the 1954 Godzilla; the only difference being exactly how they became mutated and disfigured (Reiwa through nuclear waste dumping, and Shodai being underwater H-Bomb tests).

[Tyrant_Lizard_King]

The only thing that could suggest a possible icthyosaur origin are the eyes.

[Gigantis]

I think Godzilla isn't a type of marine reptile known to man, but rather one that doesn't fit into any sort of category. A

Also, i'm pretty sure it was hinted in film that Goro somehow fused himself into Godzilla somehow.

[eabaker]

Also, i'm pretty sure it was hinted in film that Goro somehow fused himself into Godzilla somehow.

Strongly hinted, I'd say.

[AllosaurHell]

It's outrageous to me that people would rather believe the "Shin is a micro organism parasite" or "Shin is a fish" theories that has been debunked numerous times instead of looking at this and the Goro Maki Journal which literally has his origin and 1st form in them, too bad the Goro journal was stealthily released because that's why there's so little coverage on it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GODZILLA/comme ... _the_goro/

[Spuro]

It's outrageous to me that people would rather believe the "Shin is a micro organism parasite"

I mean, it's literally stated as such in the film directly...

[Jetty_Jags]

When does it state that?

[AllosaurHell]

It's outrageous to me that people would rather believe the "Shin is a micro organism parasite"

I mean, it's literally stated as such in the film directly...

His DNA is convoluted because of everything it absorbed but he didn't start out as little bacterias that formed a super being, he's literally been confirmed to be a ichthyosaurid-like marine reptile that absorbed multiple kinds of DNA to survive and evolve, it is stated as such in The Art of Godzilla and Goro Maki Journal, which are officially licensed products of course. The microorganism thing was taken from that one scientist analyzing his DNA and speculating that he's a "mixotroph" and from then on it got blown out of proportion, mixotroph can mean many different things and isn't exclusive to just microfauna that we can't see.