Why Does Every one like The showa series

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Kaltes-Herzeleid
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Kaltes-Herzeleid »

JAGzilla wrote:Heisei and Millennium absolutely have plenty of original elements, I'm not questioning that. But you can't pretend for a second that they don't recycle things every bit as egregiously as the Showa films did.
Personally, I think the difference here is that the Showa era only started doing that excessively is when budgets were reduced to shoe string tier budgets and Japanese cinema was essentially dying a slow painful death. Whereas Heisei, to my understanding, consistently had bigger budgets, hence why some are quicker to accuse them of being uninspired when elements are recycled.

(Rest of this is just personal thoughts I've opted to dump here, not a response to anyone in particular)

Though on that note (and forgive me for digressing a bit) I do think some of the criticisms of them for bringing back King Ghidorah, Mothra, and Rodan are a bit odd. They're nearly every bit as iconic as Godzilla so I'd say their returns were inevitable, even in the 90s. It's more of a question of how impactful and well done the new versions are. Heisei Ghidorah's design has stuck around for decades now, as has Mecha-King Ghidorah, though the origin for Heisei King Ghidorah is almost always discarded.

Overall I think the Millennium era handled new kaiju better than Heisei did. Orga is a better evil Godzilla clone gone wrong, Megaguirus has a delightfully sinister and arrogant personality and cool design and is typically regarded as the highlight of her movie, and Monster X is great in terms of design and posing a much more deadly challenge to Godzilla. Obviously Keizer Ghidorah was a bit off the mark but still. That and in some ways the Millennium era's reimaginings of classic kaiju seemed to register better with people too. GMK Baragon is pretty much the default nowadays and Kiryu is near universally beloved. Mothra in Tokyo S.O.S. is a high point and in terms of practical effects wizardry is a huge step above Heisei Mothra. Only exception to this is GMK Ghidorah.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Destoroyah of Worlds »

The screenplays leave a little to be desired sometimes, but you can't argue with how great the minatures and monster action is. It's timeless and filled with creativity.

For better or worse, these films don't always cut away. The millennium series is so sloppy in comparison. You can barely see what's happening with Baragon in GMK or the quick action in Final Wars. The MonsterVerse relies on cutting away too. I think part of the magic of older Godzilla films is they have incredibly long and natural takes.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Chrispy_G »

I enjoy them for how simple they are. Obviously there is a gradient in the series in terms of 'how serious vs how silly' they are, but anyone without a filter will realize that even the 'serious' entries are inherently quite silly.

When Mothra vs Godzilla is praised for being one of the darker and more serious entries...and magical tiny fairies feature prominently in the film...that puts things into a clear perspective.

I enjoy them for their brevity and for them being a snapshot of past era of cinema....and because they were so frequent, you get to clearly see a progression from film to film in technique in style. They are a fun time capsule.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by eabaker »

How realistic/naturalistic a film's elements are does not inherently correlate to how dark or serious the tone of its story is.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Terasawa »

Additionally, fantasy can be dark and serious, and a science fiction film can be dark and/or serious even with fantasy elements. (However, I don't think MvG is a "dark" film.) The Mothra films can be described as a cross-pollination of low fantasy and science fiction.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by eabaker »

Terasawa wrote:(However, I don't think MvG is a "dark" film.)
Oh, absolutely not. Nor am I aware of its having a reputation as such.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Terasawa »

It's definitely a serious film, though I don't know why we must assume the presence of "magical tiny fairies" makes it anything less than that when they're integrated as organically as they are. There are silly Godzilla films, old and new, but I don't think MvG is one of them. It's a deliberate and successful integration of fantasy concepts into a sci-fi/monster movie.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by edgaguirus »

The Showa films, with the exception of a few, tend to find balance with the serious and campy. They have their fun moments, but also carry themes or images that bring thought, fear, or suspense. G vs Gigan would be an example. The comic artist brings some amusement to the film. On the other end, we have the shadow scene, giving a creepy crawly feel to the aliens.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Blinder16 »

Sure, it does look fake compared to today's special effects; these were made more than half a century ago, with a budget that wasn't the highest worldwide. And it simply... is on par with contemporary horror and catastrophic-themed movies from other countries.
If we were to chastise Showa-era Godzilla movies, we should then stop watching 95% of all movies to ever use "conventional" special effects, and that'd be pointless.

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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Desghidorah »

Grandfather clause is part of it, along with hero worship for some of the old guard like Ishiro Honda. Not unearned mind you, but it does tend to make one overlook flaws.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Terasawa »

That implies that a lot of goodwill towards the Showa films is informed by biases and not legitimate critical evaluation or enjoyment.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by eabaker »

Maybe the focus of this thread should be on dedicated Showa fans explaining why they have such affection for that era, rather than other people speculating on why they have such affection?
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by edgaguirus »

Speculation is half the fun of these threads.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Blinder16 »

Well, of course there's some bias, if we were to judge the Showa era movies with the latest ones in mind, they'd look like some Youtube parodies instead of legit movies. And I like to see what kinds of tricks were used, that's pretty fascinating...

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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by eabaker »

Blinder16 wrote:Well, of course there's some bias, if we were to judge the Showa era movies with the latest ones in mind, they'd look like some Youtube parodies instead of legit movies. And I like to see what kinds of tricks were used, that's pretty fascinating...
In what respect would they look like "some Youtube parodies"? I can't think of many Youtube parodies I've seen with scripting, visual storytelling, production design, performances, cinematography, editing, sound design, or music that are remotely comparable to the work in even a lower-tier Showa-era Godzilla movie.
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by MechaGoji Bro7503 »

eabaker wrote:
Blinder16 wrote:Well, of course there's some bias, if we were to judge the Showa era movies with the latest ones in mind, they'd look like some Youtube parodies instead of legit movies. And I like to see what kinds of tricks were used, that's pretty fascinating...
In what respect would they look like "some Youtube parodies"? I can't think of many Youtube parodies I've seen with scripting, visual storytelling, production design, performances, cinematography, editing, sound design, or music that are remotely comparable to the work in even a lower-tier Showa-era Godzilla movie.
Yup, there's a lotta geniune craft in the lesser acknowledged Showa films, Godzilla or not. Lot of which is a treat to discover and think: "Wow how'd they do that?"
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by mikelcho »

I think everyone likes the Showa series (myself included) because...let's face it, it started all this. and that's saying something, believe me.

I've said it before and I'll say it again...the Japanese as a whole have an excellent imagination when it comes to creating monsters, giant or human-sized! The only other nation in the world that comes close to them in weirdness is Greece and its native mythology.

The Japanese are also the only nation that can make and release stories like this, even today, and still come up smelling like roses.

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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by MaxRebo320 »

In fairness, there are actual people on parts like Youtube that think lousy fan films like this are somehow "better" than the original movies they're based on, so...
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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

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This is where a lot of creativity went and playing it safe didn't get out of control. 15 films means you're probably gonna enjoy at least some of them if you're a Godzilla fan even if Showa is your least favorite of the series. It was also the birthplace for many beloved monsters and even some weapons that still get used even today.

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Re: Why Does Every one like The showa series

Post by Gojira1604 »

Why'd we accept this from a TriStar Godzilla stan & notlockthethreadimmed-

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