Talkback Thread #5: Ghidorah, the Three Headed Monster(1964)

[JVM]

This used to be one of my favorite films in the franchise but I definitely wouldn't expect it to hold up on a rewatch. King Ghidorah definitely feels like an 'oversold' character. The human story is definitely the highlight of the film in retrospect for me, I remember it being pretty solid and interesting.

[godjacob]

He was an apocalypse. If the monsters hadn't teamed up to fight him off, humanity and normal terrestrial life would have been screwed. No one ever said that he was the strongest kaiju, just that he massacred the Venusians. They don't appear to have had their own kaiju to defend them.

It's more there isn't much about Ghidorah that made him anymore destructive than other Kaiju on Earth. If it was given a scene or two of just absolutely flooring the military and more destruction scenes to highlight the dread it was causing before the fight it would've helped to sell the planet destroying terror he is hyped to be.

I actually agree with this. I adore the film, but it is not without its criticisms, and I totally agree this would have added to Ghidorah's "apocalpytic" nature.

Added in 37 seconds:

Ghidorah's defeat is so genuis to me because it along with MZ show Godzilla and Rodan can't manhandled him and they have to out think him. Rodan flying Mothra up high enough to web Ghidorah while Godzilla keeps him away is genus.

Also shows how desperate Godzilla and Rodan are when they try the same finish but there is no Mothra.

But i also agree with this. So, as usual, my thoughts on a Godzilla film are contradictory.

Don't think these conflict. You admit the film has critiques which are fair but also agree with one defense point against one critique. Seems in line.

[Legion1979]

Watching this on Pluto now. Always wondered - when the faries arrive on the What Are They Doing Now? TV show, are they entering the stage on a flying carpet?

[LSD Jellyfish]

Watching this on Pluto now. Always wondered - when the faries arrive on the What Are They Doing Now? TV show, are they entering the stage on a flying carpet?

Yeah, I've always assumed that's a prop or something, not an actual flying carpet.

I think it's interesting comparing the stage show in Mothra vs. Godzilla and the one in GTTHM. Mothra vs. Godzilla is pure exotification and exploitation. I suppose some aspects of the "Where are they now" can seem to be a little exocticized, but they appear to be there of their own free will and want to help/have a dialogue with humanity.

[LegendZilla]

Anyone else care to guess why they decided to blow the budget on Ghidorah's beams, leaving Godzilla's own atomic breath to get the short end of the stick in this movie? He never even uses it on Ghidorah from crying out loud!

[CamtheGodzillafan]

Anyone else care to guess why they decided to blow the budget on Ghidorah's beams, leaving Godzilla's own atomic breath to get the short end of the stick in this movie? He never even uses it on Ghidorah from crying out loud!

And look how much of a success Ghidorah is, who cares about Godzilla's breath being bad in one movie?

[JAGzilla]

It makes sense that if you have this shiny new Big Bad monster that three established monsters are teaming up against, you're going to give this new guy the budget he needs to sell the role. If Godzilla, with four previous movies to his name, has to get slightly shortchanged, the tradeoff is worth it.

[edgaguirus]

And the visual. Three dragon heads spraying gravity bolts all over a city is a stunning visual effect, so make it look as good as possible.

[wireframemonsters]

Anyone else care to guess why they decided to blow the budget on Ghidorah's beams, leaving Godzilla's own atomic breath to get the short end of the stick in this movie? He never even uses it on Ghidorah from crying out loud!

They definitely downgraded godzilla's power because why would godzilla need help to stop ghidorah?

[Legion1979]

Anyone else care to guess why they decided to blow the budget on Ghidorah's beams, leaving Godzilla's own atomic breath to get the short end of the stick in this movie? He never even uses it on Ghidorah from crying out loud!

They definitely downgraded godzilla's power because why would godzilla need help to stop ghidorah?

In the previous film he was defeated by two worms. In the one before that he was defeated by an ape.

Get out of that fan bubble where you're looking ahead to decades worth of later films in order to assess how Godzilla was portrayed in only the 5th movie he starred in. In 1964 Toho wasn't looking at Godzilla as this be-all, end-all powerful monster who could blow through any adversary.

The goal in 1964 was to showcase King Ghidorah, NOT to show off how powerful Godzilla was. You're thinking from a 21st century fan's perspective.

[miguelnuva]

Anyone else care to guess why they decided to blow the budget on Ghidorah's beams, leaving Godzilla's own atomic breath to get the short end of the stick in this movie? He never even uses it on Ghidorah from crying out loud!

They definitely downgraded godzilla's power because why would godzilla need help to stop ghidorah?

In the previous film he was defeated by two worms. In the one before that he was defeated by an ape.

Get out of that fan bubble where you're looking ahead to decades worth of later films in order to assess how Godzilla was portrayed in only the 5th movie he starred in. In 1964 Toho wasn't looking at Godzilla as this be-all, end-all powerful monster who could blow through any adversary.

The goal in 1964 was to showcase King Ghidorah, NOT to show off how powerful Godzilla was. You're thinking from a 21st century fan's perspective.

That's what he did do though even in 1964. As we all know Godzilla was the villian that needed to be overcome.

Kong needed to draw power from something Godzilla was weak to and Kong just edges him out(unless you listen to Toho's stupid draw.)

Mothra also outsmarted him when the Larva defeat him.

Rodan is the first time a kaiju really stands his ground in a straight power battle.

But it's a moot point because you're right Ghidorah is on an entirely different level as was up till 72.

[wireframemonsters]

Anyone else care to guess why they decided to blow the budget on Ghidorah's beams, leaving Godzilla's own atomic breath to get the short end of the stick in this movie? He never even uses it on Ghidorah from crying out loud!

They definitely downgraded godzilla's power because why would godzilla need help to stop ghidorah?

In the previous film he was defeated by two worms. In the one before that he was defeated by an ape.

Get out of that fan bubble where you're looking ahead to decades worth of later films in order to assess how Godzilla was portrayed in only the 5th movie he starred in. In 1964 Toho wasn't looking at Godzilla as this be-all, end-all powerful monster who could blow through any adversary.

The goal in 1964 was to showcase King Ghidorah, NOT to show off how powerful Godzilla was. You're thinking from a 21st century fan's perspective.

He was defeated but his power wasn't downgraded. I'm okay making godzilla weaker for the story but he's a better character when he's strong.

[Legion1979]

I'm okay making godzilla weaker for the story but he's a better character when he's strong.

Nah. The stronger Toho has made Godzilla over the last 30 years the less interesting he's become.

[Follinollante]

I'm okay making godzilla weaker for the story but he's a better character when he's strong.

Nah. The stronger Toho has made Godzilla over the last 30 years the less interesting he's become.

It really depends. I, for one, get really bored when all I see on the screen is Godzilla getting his dick hammered in by the latest super-threat. Godzilla just manhandling everything does get old as soon as the initial "oh man, this dude's insane" feeling wears off.

[edgaguirus]

Watching this on Pluto now. Always wondered - when the faries arrive on the What Are They Doing Now? TV show, are they entering the stage on a flying carpet?

Yeah, I've always assumed that's a prop or something, not an actual flying carpet.

I think it's interesting comparing the stage show in Mothra vs. Godzilla and the one in GTTHM. Mothra vs. Godzilla is pure exotification and exploitation. I suppose some aspects of the "Where are they now" can seem to be a little exocticized, but they appear to be there of their own free will and want to help/have a dialogue with humanity.

The events of M vs G showed the Shobijin that the people of Japan aren't all bad, so they may see possible benefits in maintaining a diplomatic relationship. That relationship certainly worked when their kaiju and Japan's kaiju saved both Japan and Infant Island from the threat of KG.

[LSD Jellyfish]

In prep for Godzilla Minus one I’m re-watching some Godzilla films in preparation.

Random thoughts:

-Similar to Mothra Vs Godzilla, I like how a lot of the humorous character moments the early Godzilla films. For example, there’s that scene where Naoka is bringing the Venusian into the hotel, and the man and the reception says,”Are you doing a project on the homeless now?” before giving a really nasty face. Likewise, there’s that scene where her and her brother enter a cafe and the brother says,”I’m not paying”(in reference to paying for the professors drinks” and the barista looks annoyed,”what do you mean?” Before he clarifies. These little quips don’t overstay their welcome, but they add fun brief moments of humor that add life to the background characters.

-To clear something up, I paid special attention to some scenes in Japanese this time around. There’s been a lot of debate about the continuity that this film shares with Rodan (1956) and if it’s the same Rodan.

Anyways, the Venusian says that volcanic gas will resurrect Rodan. The verb used is Fukkatsu, which is revival or resurrection. The English subtitles make it seem like it’ll just be woken up, but the Japanese more directly implies a sort of resurrection. In other words, this Rodan is one of the two from the 1956 film and either was killed/trapped in a state of suspended animation and has been “resurrected/revived” by volcanic gas. It’s not that Rodan was just randomly sleeping there or something.

GTTHM was good, but I also realized this time around how I hate the English title. The Japanese title, I think is a bit more accurate and summarizes what is about to unfold a bit better.

https://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/the-m ... 30862.html

[miguelnuva]

I'm okay making godzilla weaker for the story but he's a better character when he's strong.

Nah. The stronger Toho has made Godzilla over the last 30 years the less interesting he's become.

He's never not been strong.

Ghidorah and his clones are the only ones to ever out match him. Kong and Rodan were equals and Mothra wins because she always outsmarts him.

[HeiseiGodzilla117]

Anyways, the Venusian says that volcanic gas will resurrect Rodan. The verb used is Fukkatsu, which is revival or resurrection. The English subtitles make it seem like it’ll just be woken up, but the Japanese more directly implies a sort of resurrection. In other words, this Rodan is one of the two from the 1956 film and either was killed/trapped in a state of suspended animation and has been “resurrected/revived” by volcanic gas. It’s not that Rodan was just randomly sleeping there or something.

You just blew my mind. I always assumed it was a totally different Rodan.

[JAGzilla]

I never had a strong assumption either way on whether '64 Rodan was one of the '56 originals or their offspring. I prefer the idea that he was an original, though. And it allows his lines about past trouble with humanity to actually make sense. Nice to have that confirmed. Good catch, LSD!

[edgaguirus]

I'd always felt that this Rodan was a survivor from the original film. It somehow survived the eruption, took time to heal its wounds, and then woke up. Using the term resurrection fits that scenario.