Favorite Heisei Gamera Movie?

[shadowgigan]

I've seen people draw comparisons between Irys and Destoroyah, understandably so given their final-boss status of both Godzilla and Gamera's respective eras. Personally, I feel that Irys is more analogous to Biollante. Let me explain why :

1. Both are tentacled, further-mutated variants of pre-existing monsters (Godzilla and Gyaos respetively)
2. Both have a connection with a young human female.
3. Both were featured in films darker and moodier than most of their contemporaries.

Fair enough. Biollante and Irys were polar opposites in one big way, though. Biollante was an innocent victim of manipulative forces beyond her control, turned into a monster by the self-serving actions of Dr. Shiragami, the bioterrorists, and Godzilla's cells. Irys, by contrast, was a sinister force himself and the one manipulating Ayana for his own ends. Maybe. G3 is deliberately vague on the question of who was manipulating whom and to what extent. Irys doesn't come across as a good guy, though.

Iris comes across as truly malicious to me. Even Legion was just doing what it would do, the proliferation of its species. But Iris comes across as acting with intent, just a nefarious, hateful creature.

[LegendZilla]

I've seen people draw comparisons between Irys and Destoroyah, understandably so given their final-boss status of both Godzilla and Gamera's respective eras. Personally, I feel that Irys is more analogous to Biollante. Let me explain why :

1. Both are tentacled, further-mutated variants of pre-existing monsters (Godzilla and Gyaos respetively)
2. Both have a connection with a young human female.
3. Both were featured in films darker and moodier than most of their contemporaries.

Fair enough. Biollante and Irys were polar opposites in one big way, though. Biollante was an innocent victim of manipulative forces beyond her control, turned into a monster by the self-serving actions of Dr. Shiragami, the bioterrorists, and Godzilla's cells. Irys, by contrast, was a sinister force himself and the one manipulating Ayana for his own ends. Maybe. G3 is deliberately vague on the question of who was manipulating whom and to what extent. Irys doesn't come across as a good guy, though.

It's still debated whether or not Irys was actually innocent at first, only to be warped by Ayana's motivations. I don't necessarily stand with this theory, but it holds water.

[Ryanosaurus]

I watched these movies for the first time a few months ago... never even knew of their existence until then, really. Fantastic films all around, and I actually just ordered the trilogy a few days ago. As for my ranking...

3) Attack of Legion: This is one of the best pure kaiju films I've seen, along with all the trappings associated within the genre. Firstly, the effects are a clear step up from the previous entry, and--by extension--the fights are absolutely some of the best (if not the best) of its kind. And the wintry setting? *chef's kiss* Absolutely love the icy, algid landscapes; it sort of accentuates the cold, unfeeling nature of Legion. Unfortunately, I struggle to remember much of the film's human characters, as from what I can recall they're a bit one-dimensional. But for what I felt Legion strove to be, it achieved.

2) Guardian of the Universe: Okay, so there's a lot about GotU which I feel is simply improved upon in its sequels (e.g. effects, character arcs, cinematography, etc.); this movie certainly, at least to me, feels the most amateurish of the trilogy. Now having said that, this film has a ton of heart and just embraces its concept with open arms. In a weird way, it kind of reminds me of Sam Raimi's first Spider-Man film in that it goes against the grain at the time, injecting a bit more vibrancy to the mix while most other flicks are going darker and more sinister. So despite its faults, GotU just sticks with me more than Legion, which I felt was a bit more stereotypical of its genre (and I hate to even say that, because following a formula isn't necessarily a bad thing by any means, and Legion pulls things off phenomenally well).

1) Revenge of Iris: Possibly the greatest action scene in the trilogy and, in my opinion, the greatest effect sequences in the trilogy. But this isn't what first comes to mind when I think of Iris; it's the story and Ayana's character. Personally, I thought it was a stroke of genius to reference back to the (relative) playful action of GotU, but now through an entirely different lens. The characters are much deeper and more raw than its predecessors, in my opinion, and--I dunno--there's just more to chew on when I think about this movie. Now it isn't without its faults: there are two characters in the film (i.e. some nihilistic dude w/ a creepy smile and his friend), whom I have no idea what their deal was (or, at least, their plot point could've been handled better). But, Revenge of Iris struck a stronger emotional cord than the others in the trilogy, and I felt the film tried--and succeeded--to be more than your average, run-of-the-mill monster flick.

[Angilasman]

^ Happy to see you enjoy them!

You know, when I was a kid coming to the internet to nerd out about this stuff the Gamera Trilogy was kinda on a pedestal. It was the high watermark of what the genre could do and it was very much in the front of fans' minds in the late '90s and '00s. It's the first thing you'd be recommended if you were interested in the genre.

Now that the MonsterVerse, Shin series, and Minus One have taken the spot as the contemporaries it means the trilogy is a layer or two further down, so it's fun to see people finally come around to it and be blown away!

[LSD Jellyfish]

1) Revenge of Iris: Possibly the greatest action scene in the trilogy and, in my opinion, the greatest effect sequences in the trilogy. But this isn't what first comes to mind when I think of Iris; it's the story and Ayana's character. Personally, I thought it was a stroke of genius to reference back to the (relative) playful action of GotU, but now through an entirely different lens. The characters are much deeper and more raw than its predecessors, in my opinion, and--I dunno--there's just more to chew on when I think about this movie. Now it isn't without its faults: there are two characters in the film (i.e. some nihilistic dude w/ a creepy smile and his friend), whom I have no idea what their deal was (or, at least, their plot point could've been handled better). But, Revenge of Iris struck a stronger emotional cord than the others in the trilogy, and I felt the film tried--and succeeded--to be more than your average, run-of-the-mill monster flick.

Glad you enjoyed it, and like Angilasman above me it's fun seeing people discover these for the first time.

Anyways, in regards to the two human antagonists I have my own theory about them:
In the late 90's cults, new religious movements, and occultism exploded. Most of these groups are "harmless" (well, they're scams), but serious damage and crimes have been committed in their names. The most famous example, is the Aum Shinrikyo cult. They're the ones that bombed Tokyo Station with Sarin gas.

However, somewhat alarmingly, many of these groups have mild/major political power in what otherwise should be an agonistic Japan. Look into this group for example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soka_Gakkai

There's many both internal Japanese groups, you can see a full breakdown is here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_new_religions

I believe their role in the movie is a stark warning/fear of Japanese society embracing these groups and their intersection with politics. It's brief and seemingly non-sensical, but I believe that the woman is referred to as "the prime-ministers fortune teller". Spoiler alert: the prime-minister shouldn't/doesn't have a fortune teller. I'm not an expert on Japanese occultism and cults, but I believe this is what the film was going for, and that Japanese audiences would have understood this a bit more. Also worth noticing that depending on what version you're watching, the subtitles go completely off the rails and don't even accurately what the main human guy is saying.

That might be for the better though; what he's saying contradicts what we see. Likewise, all the stuff around Iris is pretty vague and seemingly contradictory too. I think it's okay because I'm certain at this point that the ambiguity is intentional. You have to have faith in Gamera.

I've made this comparison before, and I think the director made it himself, but if Gamera 1 is a kaiju film, and Gamera 2 is a war movie, Gamera 3 is a religious film.

[Ryanosaurus]

Glad you enjoyed it, and like Angilasman above me it's fun seeing people discover these for the first time.

Anyways, in regards to the two human antagonists I have my own theory about them:
In the late 90's cults, new religious movements, and occultism exploded. Most of these groups are "harmless" (well, they're scams), but serious damage and crimes have been committed in their names. The most famous example, is the Aum Shinrikyo cult. They're the ones that bombed Tokyo Station with Sarin gas.

However, somewhat alarmingly, many of these groups have mild/major political power in what otherwise should be an agonistic Japan. Look into this group for example:


There's many both internal Japanese groups, you can see a full breakdown is here:


I believe their role in the movie is a stark warning/fear of Japanese society embracing these groups and their intersection with politics. It's brief and seemingly non-sensical, but I believe that the woman is referred to as "the prime-ministers fortune teller". Spoiler alert: the prime-minister shouldn't/doesn't have a fortune teller. I'm not an expert on Japanese occultism and cults, but I believe this is what the film was going for, and that Japanese audiences would have understood this a bit more. Also worth noticing that depending on what version you're watching, the subtitles go completely off the rails and don't even accurately what the main human guy is saying.

That might be for the better though; what he's saying contradicts what we see. Likewise, all the stuff around Iris is pretty vague and seemingly contradictory too. I think it's okay because I'm certain at this point that the ambiguity is intentional. You have to have faith in Gamera.

I've made this comparison before, and I think the director made it himself, but if Gamera 1 is a kaiju film, and Gamera 2 is a war movie, Gamera 3 is a religious film.

Really appreciate the response! Haven't gone through much of your second link yet, but it's crazy reading about Soka Gakkai. This certainly helps explain away a few of what little qualms I had with RoI (and besides, it's not as if they were a *huge* part of the film, but they did aid in driving some plot points). Now I already think higher of the film hah

Also, I'm really curious about the subtitle changes now...

[LSD Jellyfish]

Also, I'm really curious about the subtitle changes now...

I'm referring to this set, but realized that the Arrow release is probably fine (haven't seen it):


I recall when I watched Gamera 3 last time, huge swaths of the culty man's dialogue just goes unsubtitled. From what I could tell, a lot of it was weird philosophical stuff, so I don't doubt it was complex, but it was something that led me to feel like I was missing something.

I'm due for a rewatch on all these in better quality!

[JAGzilla]

Yeah, the Mill Creek G3 DVD was missing a lot of subtitles for nihilist guy's lines. I had no idea what he was about on my first viewing. The Arrow Blu-ray's subs are complete, and I had a much easier time following everything on the rewatch. Relatively speaking, of course; this is definitely a vague, foggy kind of movie at times. It throws out a bunch of ideas and worldviews, and leaves it up to the main characters and viewer to take away what they will.

In some ways I prefer the simple, straightforward monster movie plots of G1 and G2, but I can respect G3's heavier and more complicated material all day. And I do love seeing kaiju intersect with prophecy, religion, apocalyptic fears, and that kind of thing.

[Mechagigan]

1) GOTU - Just a classic from top to bottom. It's a non-stop ride, one exciting or intriguing scene after another. The incredible stadium scenes may be my favorite in any Kaiju media - Gamera's first appearance is so insanely sick. Amazing cinematography. I really think, somewhere along production, Godzilla 2014 took major notes from scenes such as those. Not to mention Gyaos' vague similarities to Muto. The cast is extremely memorable and lots of fun - especially Osako, the greatest Kaiju character of all time after Captain Gordon. And, needless to say, the effects are awesome. Gyaos is perfectly demonic and disgusting, and it's probably my favorite Gamera design - it's the perfect middle ground between the cutesy super-monster of the past and the horrible beast he'd become. I especially love his big googly eyes.

2) RoI - Equally, if not moreso a classic to GOTU - it's twisted tone, weird imagery and just overall unsettling world is so encapsulating. It feels very mythic and unreal, in a way that only the Gamera series really can - though, I definitely see this vibe come through in GMK's spiritual world. The sheer level of destruction and horror is so visceral - they're flying turtles and Power Ranger squids, but the death, violence and chaos they unleash is so engagingly real. Gamera's design is genuinely amazing, lifelike, and scary - I actually like it more than GOTU's in many ways, though, I guess I prefer the latter for it's more generic attributes. The murky story is seemingly intentionally strange, and perhaps too confusing for some, but I think it's meant to convey a tone above all else and does a wicked, stylistic job in doing so.

3) AoL - I know, once again I'm the contrarian. G2's action and effects are nothing short of incredible. The first Gamera sequence is so memorably weird, with him struggling as covered in the nasty alien bugs - it really reminds me of the strange stuff that'd go down in the classic films. The wicked drift entrance, the freaky alien infestations. I think, put simply, that's this movie's greatest strength - the monsters. The actual story, and characters, while not at all bad, just feels hollow. Not much important happens after roughly the airport scene - we're sort of just waiting for Gamera to, y'know, kill the baddies. The highlight for me was returning to Asagi - I really didn't feel any attachment to anyone else, there wasn't much there. Especially considering this one's longer than the other two, it occasionally felt like filler. Not to totally downplay this movie - I think it's just as awesome as the rest - but, it's not quite as perfectly well rounded as the other two. Still, I think it's obvious the sheer quality of that monster action more than makes up for the story for most fans.

[king_ghidorah]

I have really been digging on Gamera 2 lately...I still think G3 is probably my favorite, and the best of the genre besides G 54, but G2 is such a tight, sci-fi action movie! Honestly, I can make a case for any of these three! Hands down my favorite series of films ever!

[LegendZilla]

After all these years, I still personally question the notion of G3 being that good. I know it's an unpopular opinion, but I have reasons. Mind if I elaborate?

[Jomei]

G3 has some narrative issues, but it also has some of the most compelling elements and certainly some of the most achieved visual effects sequences in all of kaiju history. I think its overall achievement leads people to accept a couple flaws along with the whole package. It's kind of how I feel about vs Biollante, too--that in spite of its flaws, the things it does right (or almost right) are so appealing that it compensates for some issues.

[Mechagigan]

I think G3 is carried by it's visuals and ideas more than the writing itself, if that makes sense - I like that it's really ambiguous, and strange, though that may be due to subtitle issues on my copies (so I've read). Totally agree about it having the same oddball spirit as Biollante, it gets a little "dark fantasy" with things, and I love that atmosphere. Scenes like Gamera's first attack on the Gyaos or the amazing train station battle will always stick in with me; even character moments like the girl becoming one with Iris, or the strange Tim Burton cultist guy messing about.

I'm more critical of G2, I think that one is totally carried by the Kaiju scenes - nothing wrong with that, but next to G1 and 3 the cast and such just feel so nothing, to me. Kinda like a really, really good filler episode.

[Creature22]

I think G3 is a “walked so future films could run” scenario. It set some additional foundation for more human-centered and thematically darker kaiju films, and directly led to us getting films like GMK which in and of itself would influence movies like Minus One. Even with its flaws there really wasn’t anything like it before its release.