Some, but not necessarily all.Voyager wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:47 pmThat's literally what I said.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:25 pmDessy could show up in literally any continuity in which the events of G54 occurred.
New films will have to be tied down to the G54 film.
Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
But you yourself said they’d needed to be connected to G54. How is that not a hinderence?LegendZilla wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:48 pmSome, but not necessarily all.Voyager wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:47 pmThat's literally what I said.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 9:25 pm
Dessy could show up in literally any continuity in which the events of G54 occurred.
New films will have to be tied down to the G54 film.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
You’re acting like continuity itself is a hinderance. If Toho decided to bring Dessy back, all they need to do is make a movie tied to G54 in some way shape or form. After they got it out of the way, they’ll just reboot again like they always do.Voyager wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:31 pmBut you yourself said they’d needed to be connected to G54. How is that not a hinderence?
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
It is a hinderence. Filmmakers cant use Dessy unless they make a sequel to G54.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:58 pmYou’re acting like continuity itself is a hinderance. If Toho decided to bring Dessy back, all they need to do is make a movie tied to G54 in some way shape or form. After they got it out of the way, they’ll just reboot again like they always do.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Why is it a big deal if they do?Voyager wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 11:11 pmIt is a hinderence. Filmmakers cant use Dessy unless they make a sequel to G54.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:58 pmYou’re acting like continuity itself is a hinderance. If Toho decided to bring Dessy back, all they need to do is make a movie tied to G54 in some way shape or form. After they got it out of the way, they’ll just reboot again like they always do.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
It’s a hinderance to their visions.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
No, but you're assuming people actually want a sequel to G54.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:27 amWould someone hinder their own vision if they actually wanted to make a sequel to G54 and use Dessy?
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Who says there can't be any out there? Plus, you said you won't be opposed to a theoretical return to the Showa continuity, so why not bring Destoroyah back that way? Also, by your logic, Ghidorah shouldn't be able to be done right unless you make a direct sequel to GTTHM.Voyager wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:29 amNo, but you're assuming people actually want a sequel to G54.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:27 amWould someone hinder their own vision if they actually wanted to make a sequel to G54 and use Dessy?
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
1. So? My fever dream does not affect reality.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:34 amWho says there can't be any out there? Plus, you said you won't be opposed to a theoretical return to the Showa continuity, so why not bring Destoroyah back that way? Also, by your logic, Ghidorah shouldn't be able to be done right unless you make a direct sequel to GTTHM.Voyager wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:29 amNo, but you're assuming people actually want a sequel to G54.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:27 am
Would someone hinder their own vision if they actually wanted to make a sequel to G54 and use Dessy?
2. My logic? What kind of fucked logic is that? Ghidorah isn’t tied down by origin like Dessy is.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Who says Dessy HAS to be tied to their origins? If Ghidorah can range from being a hostile planet-killing alien, future bio-weapon or even a guardian deity, most would have no qualms with changing any kaiju’s origins as long as they are themselves in form and function. For example, what if Toho decided to bring Dessy back, what if they made him some kind of demon?Voyager wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:21 am1. So? My fever dream does not affect reality.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:34 amWho says there can't be any out there? Plus, you said you won't be opposed to a theoretical return to the Showa continuity, so why not bring Destoroyah back that way? Also, by your logic, Ghidorah shouldn't be able to be done right unless you make a direct sequel to GTTHM.
2. My logic? What kind of skreeonked logic is that? Ghidorah isn’t tied down by origin like Dessy is.
Also, when you come to think of it, Dessy’s origin is not THAT different from Godzilla’s in that both are the result of the folly of man in the form of a super-weapon. I’m guessing the main difference is that the A-Bomb is a real life-weapon that has caused actual death and human misery whereas the OD is fictional.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
1. You said that. You did. And Ivo-Goji.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:28 amWho says Dessy HAS to be tied to their origins? If Ghidorah can range from being a hostile planet-killing alien, future bio-weapon or even a guardian deity, most would have no qualms with changing any kaiju’s origins as long as they are themselves in form and function. For example, what if Toho decided to bring Dessy back, what if they made him some kind of demon?Voyager wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:21 am1. So? My fever dream does not affect reality.LegendZilla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 12:34 am
Who says there can't be any out there? Plus, you said you won't be opposed to a theoretical return to the Showa continuity, so why not bring Destoroyah back that way? Also, by your logic, Ghidorah shouldn't be able to be done right unless you make a direct sequel to GTTHM.
2. My logic? What kind of skreeonked logic is that? Ghidorah isn’t tied down by origin like Dessy is.
Also, when you come to think of it, Dessy’s origin is not THAT different from Godzilla’s in that both are the result of the folly of man in the form of a super-weapon. I’m guessing the main difference is that the A-Bomb is a real life-weapon that has caused actual death and human misery whereas the OD is fictional.
LegendZilla wrote: Dessy could show up in literally any continuity in which the events of G54 occurred.
Sure, Destoroyah’s form can be replicated, but can his function? Dessy’s function is pretty much explicitly tied to previous events. It’s just nature biting humans in the ass for their arrogance about killing Godzilla. And… let’s not have a demon-Dessy. I hate that she’s already got that reputation in the fandom, I don’t need it to be reality.Ivo-goji wrote:as long as he embodies the concept of being a monster born from the weapon that killed Godzilla, his essence is unchanged.
2. The difference is that Godzilla’s origin is tied to real life events, while Dessy’s is tied to Godzilla’s death. Destoroyah can not exist in a world without Godzilla or the Oxygen Destroyer.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
You don't understand what I mean. I'm talking about the Oxygen Destroyer as a meta concept.
The events of G54 don't have to occur in a film's backstory for the audience to perceive the weapon's connotation as something that can kill Godzilla.
It's almost as recognizable to Godzilla lore as Superman's vulnerability to Kryptonite. No one has to see Kryptonite kill Superman to know it can kill Superman.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Still, for Destroyah to exist the Oxygen Destroyer has to exist. And the Oxygen Destroyer exists to kill Godzilla. Bringing in that weapon any other way would tarnish its importance.
So you're pretty much retelling a good chunk of Godzilla vs Destroyah. Been there, done that.
It makes no sense for "Dessy" to come back.
So you're pretty much retelling a good chunk of Godzilla vs Destroyah. Been there, done that.
It makes no sense for "Dessy" to come back.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Unless you're saying the entire plot of G54 has to be retold in order for the Oxygen Destroyer to appear again in any capacity (which is nonsense and is a giant middle finger to the artistic freedom of this franchise) then that is not an actual response to my argument.Legion1979 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 6:01 am Still, for Destroyah to exist the Oxygen Destroyer has to exist. And the Oxygen Destroyer exists to kill Godzilla. Bringing in that weapon any other way would tarnish its importance.
Godzilla vs Destoroyah didn't tell the story of where the Oxygen Destroyer came from outside of about two minutes of exposition.So you're pretty much retelling a good chunk of Godzilla vs Destroyah.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
It was kind of tarnished in KOTM. I hope they didn't do that just to NOT bring Dessy in. (Woah, holy double negative.)Legion1979 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 6:01 am Still, for Destroyah to exist the Oxygen Destroyer has to exist. And the Oxygen Destroyer exists to kill Godzilla. Bringing in that weapon any other way would tarnish its importance.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
See I hate to use KotM as an example because I really dislike how the OD is used in that movie.shadowgigan wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 10:59 am It was kind of tarnished in KOTM. I hope they didn't do that just to NOT bring Dessy in. (Woah, holy double negative.)
But I'd rather defend its inclusion there than put up with the idea that G54 is so high and holy and sacred that characters and ideas particular to that film can never be touched again for fear of contaminating its glory. That mindset is poisonous to the life of the Godzilla series.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Then it's a good thing that nobody suggested anything of the kind.Ivo-goji wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 1:59 pmSee I hate to use KotM as an example because I really dislike how the OD is used in that movie.shadowgigan wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 10:59 am It was kind of tarnished in KOTM. I hope they didn't do that just to NOT bring Dessy in. (Woah, holy double negative.)
But I'd rather defend its inclusion there than put up with the idea that G54 is so high and holy and sacred that characters and ideas particular to that film can never be touched again for fear of contaminating its glory. That mindset is poisonous to the life of the Godzilla series.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
Does Destroyah's origin necessarily have to be the Oxygen Destroyer? Or can his origin be tied to another plot made controversial super weapon used to attempt to kill Godzilla, only for it to create an abomination worse than Godzilla and now Godzilla is reluctantly the only hope?
Edit: Lots of IDW Godzilla comics have brought back Destroyah multiple times without the Oxygen Destroyer with good success and acclaim. One of the most praised idw comics is Godzilla cataclysm where he's the main antagonist kaiju .
Edit: Lots of IDW Godzilla comics have brought back Destroyah multiple times without the Oxygen Destroyer with good success and acclaim. One of the most praised idw comics is Godzilla cataclysm where he's the main antagonist kaiju .
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GVK: TNE is a modern day 70s Showa Godzilla movie. Being a massive budget modern blockbuster CGI film instead of traditional 70s tokusatsu techniques doesn't change that.
Monsterverse is not similar to either MCU nor Bayformers just because all three are big budget CGI blockbuster franchises.
Monsterverse is not similar to either MCU nor Bayformers just because all three are big budget CGI blockbuster franchises.
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Re: Heisei kaiju you'd like to see re-appear
^I think one too many people are thinking too hard into why (in their opinion) Dessy can't be brought back. Why can't more people think outside the box and come up with ways to work around whatever issues in place?