Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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goji89
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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ShinGojira14 wrote: Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:22 pm ... ... ...what the skreeonk was this thread about, again? :?
The meaning of life.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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I don't believe this movie deserves to be "hated" or "despised" or "looked down upon". I think we all can agree that the movie aimed to mash up all the conflicting genres of Showa/Heisei and Millenium, Toho had a lot of expectations on their shoulders, so they tried to please absolutely everybody, from GINO haters, to hard rock fans, to Americans who like slow-mo and explosions to classic Toho fans to Godzilla fans, they bit off an infinite amount more than they should've.
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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_JNavs_ wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 10:55 am I don't believe this movie deserves to be "hated" or "despised" or "looked down upon". I think we all can agree that the movie aimed to mash up all the conflicting genres of Showa/Heisei and Millenium, Toho had a lot of expectations on their shoulders, so they tried to please absolutely everybody, from GINO haters, to hard rock fans, to Americans who like slow-mo and explosions to classic Toho fans to Godzilla fans, they bit off an infinite amount more than they should've.
Aaaaand that was the problem. It tried to please everyone under the fandoms sun. Making it a jumbled mess. It deserved the hate to a point.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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It gets and deserves the hate because it sucks.
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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Voyager wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:24 pm It gets and deserves the hate because it sucks.
Yes, yes.....let the hate flow through you.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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I have a sad story. The other day, a buddy of mine started feeling sick. Suddenly he didn't much care for Final Wars. That's how I knew it was the coronavirus.
The sense of taste is always the first to go. :cry:
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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Major sssspielberg! wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:54 am I have a sad story. The other day, a buddy of mine started feeling sick. Suddenly he didn't much care for Final Wars. That's how I knew it was the coronavirus.
The sense of taste is always the first to go. :cry:
Holy crap...... :lol: :lol:

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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_JNavs_ wrote: Thu Apr 22, 2021 10:55 am I don't believe this movie deserves to be "hated" or "despised" or "looked down upon". I think we all can agree that the movie aimed to mash up all the conflicting genres of Showa/Heisei and Millenium, Toho had a lot of expectations on their shoulders, so they tried to please absolutely everybody, from GINO haters, to hard rock fans, to Americans who like slow-mo and explosions to classic Toho fans to Godzilla fans, they bit off an infinite amount more than they should've.
Couldn't have said it better. When you try too hard to appease everybody, you end up appeasing only a very few.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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Well, I've kept my mouth shut for YEARS and avoided this topic. Let me tell you what I've learned about this film, it's director, and the process.
First, I learned the director apparently hated or disliked, or hasn't even seen ANY Godzilla film prior to Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla 1974.
Second, I learned that he wasn't even a fan of Godzilla.
Third, he literally had a table of bandai figures and went 'yeah this one looks good, put him in the movie', not even giving the monsters abilities and concepts a chance to show, aka, Hedorah being nerfed so much he became a low ranking Ultraman Taro villain.
Fourth, I had to deal with people fan wanking this skreeonking movie since 2004. Holy. poop. There used to be a person here named GXG who'd come up with every way possible to make GFW Godzilla out as this skreeonking god.
Fifth, the director just wanted to make a Matrix/Star Wars/X-men movie. And the way the movie was written and shot, Godzilla was a last minute detail he was skreeonking forced to add.
Sixth, the movie was SO skreeonking panned by the Japanese audience, Godzilla was FORCED to retire. "OH BUT TOHO WANTED TO STOP MAKING FILMS IN 2005!' Yeah, and it was 2004. Godzilla took a skreeonking bullet and died on his anniversary, and had to wait until 2014 to come back in full swing. It took 10 years for them to realize what to do with Godzilla after GFW skreeonked him over so hard that the Japanese fans were SICK of him.
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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LamangoKaijura wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:24 pm Well, I've kept my mouth shut for YEARS and avoided this topic. Let me tell you what I've learned about this film, it's director, and the process.
First, I learned the director apparently hated or disliked, or hasn't even seen ANY Godzilla film prior to Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla 1974.
Second, I learned that he wasn't even a fan of Godzilla.
Third, he literally had a table of bandai figures and went 'yeah this one looks good, put him in the movie', not even giving the monsters abilities and concepts a chance to show, aka, Hedorah being nerfed so much he became a low ranking Ultraman Taro villain.
Fourth, I had to deal with people fan wanking this skreeonking movie since 2004. Holy. poop. There used to be a person here named GXG who'd come up with every way possible to make GFW Godzilla out as this skreeonking god.
Fifth, the director just wanted to make a Matrix/Star Wars/X-men movie. And the way the movie was written and shot, Godzilla was a last minute detail he was skreeonking forced to add.
Sixth, the movie was SO skreeonking panned by the Japanese audience, Godzilla was FORCED to retire. "OH BUT TOHO WANTED TO STOP MAKING FILMS IN 2005!' Yeah, and it was 2004. Godzilla took a skreeonking bullet and died on his anniversary, and had to wait until 2014 to come back in full swing. It took 10 years for them to realize what to do with Godzilla after GFW skreeonked him over so hard that the Japanese fans were SICK of him.
Amen brother.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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LamangoKaijura wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:24 pm Well, I've kept my mouth shut for YEARS and avoided this topic. Let me tell you what I've learned about this film, it's director, and the process.
First, I learned the director apparently hated or disliked, or hasn't even seen ANY Godzilla film prior to Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla 1974.
Second, I learned that he wasn't even a fan of Godzilla.
Third, he literally had a table of bandai figures and went 'yeah this one looks good, put him in the movie', not even giving the monsters abilities and concepts a chance to show, aka, Hedorah being nerfed so much he became a low ranking Ultraman Taro villain.
Fourth, I had to deal with people fan wanking this skreeonking movie since 2004. Holy. poop. There used to be a person here named GXG who'd come up with every way possible to make GFW Godzilla out as this skreeonking god.
Fifth, the director just wanted to make a Matrix/Star Wars/X-men movie. And the way the movie was written and shot, Godzilla was a last minute detail he was skreeonking forced to add.
Sixth, the movie was SO skreeonking panned by the Japanese audience, Godzilla was FORCED to retire. "OH BUT TOHO WANTED TO STOP MAKING FILMS IN 2005!' Yeah, and it was 2004. Godzilla took a skreeonking bullet and died on his anniversary, and had to wait until 2014 to come back in full swing. It took 10 years for them to realize what to do with Godzilla after GFW skreeonked him over so hard that the Japanese fans were SICK of him.
I feel like this sentiment is why Monster X got buried so hard in the KWC
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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LamangoKaijura wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:24 pm Sixth, the movie was SO skreeonking panned by the Japanese audience, Godzilla was FORCED to retire.
This ignores the fact that the series had dwindling box office for years at this point but sure, I guess.
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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LamangoKaijura wrote: Fri Apr 23, 2021 5:24 pm Well, I've kept my mouth shut for YEARS and avoided this topic. Let me tell you what I've learned about this film, it's director, and the process.
First, I learned the director apparently hated or disliked, or hasn't even seen ANY Godzilla film prior to Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla 1974.
Second, I learned that he wasn't even a fan of Godzilla.
Third, he literally had a table of bandai figures and went 'yeah this one looks good, put him in the movie', not even giving the monsters abilities and concepts a chance to show, aka, Hedorah being nerfed so much he became a low ranking Ultraman Taro villain.
Fourth, I had to deal with people fan wanking this skreeonking movie since 2004. Holy. poop. There used to be a person here named GXG who'd come up with every way possible to make GFW Godzilla out as this skreeonking god.
Fifth, the director just wanted to make a Matrix/Star Wars/X-men movie. And the way the movie was written and shot, Godzilla was a last minute detail he was skreeonking forced to add.
Sixth, the movie was SO skreeonking panned by the Japanese audience, Godzilla was FORCED to retire. "OH BUT TOHO WANTED TO STOP MAKING FILMS IN 2005!' Yeah, and it was 2004. Godzilla took a skreeonking bullet and died on his anniversary, and had to wait until 2014 to come back in full swing. It took 10 years for them to realize what to do with Godzilla after GFW skreeonked him over so hard that the Japanese fans were SICK of him.
Everything that needed to be said has been said. This post no, no....this damn masterpiece is how I feel. GFW was never made for the fans.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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It's unfortunate that the anniversary film was doomed from the start.
Are you saying that I put an abnormal brain into a 7 1/2 foot long, 54 inch wide....Gorilla! Is that what you're telling me?

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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"ooooh boo-hoo, Lee Harvey Kitamura TOOK GODZILLA AWAY FROM US IN HIS PRIME"
You can complain about fanwank all you want, but the over-the-top hatred of Final Wars is INFINITELY more irritating. The Japanese public was sick of Godzilla well before Final Wars. It took 10 years to do a new film because Toho's business model led to oversaturation. Ryuhei Kitamura, like many directors before and since, took the opportunity and made the movie he wanted to make. Whether it was made for the fans or not, I and many other fans have found it satisfying and enjoyable.
Anyways, congratulations! Here's your Big Brain Crown for not liking Godzilla Final Wars. You're officially a True and Honest Godzilla Fan™!
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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Major sssspielberg! wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 7:05 am "ooooh boo-hoo, Lee Harvey Kitamura TOOK GODZILLA AWAY FROM US IN HIS PRIME"
You can complain about fanwank all you want, but the over-the-top hatred of Final Wars is INFINITELY more irritating. The Japanese public was sick of Godzilla well before Final Wars. It took 10 years to do a new film because Toho's business model led to oversaturation. Ryuhei Kitamura, like many directors before and since, took the opportunity and made the movie he wanted to make. Whether it was made for the fans or not, I and many other fans have found it satisfying and enjoyable.
Anyways, congratulations! Here's your Big Brain Crown for not liking Godzilla Final Wars. You're officially a True and Honest Godzilla Fan™!
Yay. *Puts on crown*

Sits on throne of FW broken dvd's and fanboy tears.

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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Over the years I've seen a lot of people blame Final Wars for causing the genre hiatus along with positing their ideas for a 50th-anniversary film from a third installment of the Kiryu saga, a GMK sequel to even a Heisei continuation. However, I think what a lot of people tend to overlook is that Final Wars could have only ever been Final Wars. The Millenium series was Toho's attempt to keep the series fresh through experimentation after the oversaturation and diminishing returns of the Heisei era. The plans to establish a new continuity failed and even the Kiryu saga didn't do so well at the end with Tokyo SOS having a greatly diminished box office from GXMG and that was with even Mothra, MG, and Godzilla. Even if Final Wars had the quality writing of Shin Godzilla it wouldn't have been a success because the market at the time was just completely burned out by Kaiju movies, Toho's strategy of bringing in the top 5 peaked with GMK and just diminished from that point on. You could argue that the critical response and word of mouth was what tanked Final War's box office but the premiere week gross says otherwise

Even with Kitamura, nearly all of the heavy hitters and the allure of a 50th anniversary weren't enough at the time, and blaming Kitamura for it is just unfair especially when the series has had movies of similar quality (Space-Godzilla, Vs. Mothra 92) make significantly more money

I think Kitamura did the best movie he could personally do, could the movie have been a bit tighter, had more developed fights? Of course. The story could have been a bit tighter and I don't like how some of the monsters such as Hedorah are just decimated with no real fight but at the same time

Kitamura's the only one that would have brought them back. Monsters such as Kumonga, Kamaracus, Hedorah, Gigan, hadn't been in a movie since the 70s, this was and remains for many of them their last appearance. In this way, Final Wars does succeed n its goal of being an anniversary film, it is a rapid-fire introduction to not just the Godzilla series but various other Toho movies and a brief spotlight of Goji's villains. Even if I disagree with their portrayal I'm happy to see them back on the screen even if only for a short while

Now to clarify I'm not saying you can't criticize the movie at all, as I've already addressed there's plentyto criticize. (I mean a lot of its a literal hodgepodge of early 2000s action movie stuff) But speaking from a realist standpoint Kitamura and his direction was the only direction Toho was ever going to go in. Compare the number of planned scripts for what would become Destroyah or even Space-Godzilla, to the amount we know that proceeded Final Wars.

Final War is a mostly harmless movie it doesn't break the tenants of the series, reinvent Godzilla, change the continuity. Its one goal is to be entertaining

And for me, it is pretty awesome, for others FW is not and I totally get why but at this point I just consider it ancient history. Its direction won’t be repeated, Kitamura won't be back, the genre is resurgent both in Japan and the US, I see no more reason to carry old grudges about it any longer and I can enjoy its particular take on the series. But take it for what you will I'm biased and I admit it gladly

Also Remember its Legion1979’s favorite film
Last edited by ROMG4 on Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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ROMG4 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:27 am
Also Remember its Legion1979’s favorite film
I miss that crazy bastard

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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goji89 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:12 am
ROMG4 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:27 am
Also Remember its Legion1979’s favorite film
I miss that crazy bastard
We lost him to Facebook, gosh darn it

in the past 10 years of TK against all the insane amount of things that have happened, that alone is easily one of the most awful things that happened here.

He just left, packed his backs left to get milk and never came back
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Never forget tadpole :g2k:
Cinematic Kaiju wrote:"...And you keep still because you think that maybe his visual acuity is based on movement like T-Rex - he'll lose you if you don't move. But no, not Godzilla. You stare at him, and he just stares right back."
SoggyNoodles2016 wrote: Sun May 16, 2021 6:00 amI'm sowey, I didn't mean it uMu

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Re: Final Wars: Why The Hate?

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ROMG4 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:18 am
goji89 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:12 am
ROMG4 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 10:27 am
Also Remember its Legion1979’s favorite film
I miss that crazy bastard
We lost him to Facebook, gosh darn it

in the past 10 years of TK against all the insane amount of things that have happened, that alone is easily one of the most awful things that happened here.

He just left, packed his backs left to get milk and never came back
Just like my dad....... I'm still holding onto my bowl of cereal I poured myself that morning in case he returns with the milk he said he was going to get :cry:
Last edited by goji89 on Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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