Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by eabaker »

I think the first chunk of this movie is quite solid. I really like Yuki, Miki gets a little more development, and Koji and Kiyoshi are a likable enough pair of characters.

Then the Yakuza subplot hits. And that's not a bad thing in and of itself, but it isn't paying anything off, and it doesn't go anywhere; it feels like filler because nobody had any idea where to go with the story they'd set up. And the rest of the movie I find incredibly tedious. There's about 40 minutes of hollow monster fighting, MOGERA starting and stopping, ultimately almost nothing that feels connected to the first half of the movie in any meaningful way. The second half of Spacegodzilla is some of the most wasted time in the history of the series.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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eabaker wrote:I think the first chunk of this movie is quite solid. I really like Yuki, Miki gets a little more development, and Koji and Kiyoshi are a likable enough pair of characters.

Then the Yakuza subplot hits. And that's not a bad thing in and of itself, but it isn't paying anything off, and it doesn't go anywhere; it feels like filler because nobody had any idea where to go with the story they'd set up. And the rest of the movie I find incredibly tedious. There's about 40 minutes of hollow monster fighting, MOGERA starting and stopping, ultimately almost nothing that feels connected to the first half of the movie in any meaningful way. The second half of Spacegodzilla is some of the most wasted time in the history of the series.
Yeah, while not as bad as Godzilla vs. Megalon or even Godzilla`s revenge, this was the film that broke me. SpaceGodzilla is awesome conceptually, and its great how he sort of curbstomps Godzilla throughout the film, but beyond that there isn`t enough. It feels like the whole Project T thing, and the Okubo plot, should`ve had its own original movie (maybe Project T accidentally spawns some psychic monster or strange projection of Okubo?).

The big finale isn`t bad because SpaceGodzilla is a beam spammer. He actually has a wide variety of interesting attacks, like firing the crystals, his shield, the tail attack, and even his brief tackles. Same thing goes for MOGERA who also has some unique things going for him (like the drill attack, the grenade missiles, and the separation. The issue is the fight has way too much filler and inter cuts between Yuki and cast. There`s way too many shots of one of the three mosnters just standing there. Even though the crystal covered battlefield is very unique, it also makes it so cluttered and ruins any sense of size or perspective the film has.

In addition, right up until the halfway point, Space Godzilla was developed really well. He easily soloed both Godzilla and Moguera, and we got a sense of his abilities and powers. The issue is that when he lands, he just sort of dissapears, and then is shown making a crystal fortress in Fukoka. Instead of having more destruction with SG, building up why he is a credible and horrific threat, we actually get a really ardous montage of Godzilla rampaging throughout Japan, moving up from Kagoshima to Fukoka. At this point in the series, and considering we spent the first half with Godzilla and the Baby, we did not need such a long montage. Nothing really happens. And of course, way too long of a time is spent with Yuki hijacking MOGERA to go fight Godzilla. Then we have way too much of Yuki pointlessly wanting to kill Godzilla outside of MOGERA, and ultimately needing Koji to rescue him. It not only slows the fight down horrendously, but makes Yuki seem dumb.

A much better climax would be Godzilla landing ashore, and MOGERA being sent to fight Godzilla. The fight could be short, but more then the scene of just MOGERA firing a round of beams at Godzilla. Cut to SpaceGodzilla re-appearing, maybe attracted by the funky waves project T creates, and flying around Japan destroying pretty much everything in its path. This sort of happens, but there`s not an emphasis, and instead we get the dumb Claw Grab scene. MOGERA is doing OK against Godzilla, when they`re commanded to engage SpaceGodzilla who is causing a bigger issue in Fukoka. That`s when you can have brief drama about Yuki wanting to continue the fight. MOGERA flies away and engages SG, and the fight plays out like normal, where MOGERA gets a few good hits in, with the drill attack, before being blasted back. Godzilla enters, and fights with SG, and pretty much gets curbstomped. Then, MOGERA splits apart, and while Godzilla engages SG, the tower, which should have been encased with crystals to provide emphasis, is destroyed. Godzilla keeps engaging SG physically, who is now weakened, and MOGERA destroys the crystals. MOGERA is impaled, and blasted back, and Koji and Kiyoshi force Yuki to abandon ship. Godzilla absorbs energy from the crystals, or maybe SG, and charges up a beam. SG erects a final wall of crystals, and his barrier, before Godzilla fires off his beam which not only breaks through the crystals but also the shield, and completely obliterates SG. Godzilla begins to walk towrds the ocean wary, and Yuki pulls up with his weapon and aims it at a stumbling Godzila. Miki stands in front of Yuki and blocks him, and then Koji stands in front of Miki. Yuki sort of grunts as Ms. Gondo, pulls up from behind and motions him to lower the weapon and says that she has forgiven Godzilla for killing her brother and so should Yuki. The film ends with everyone

The main difference with my version is that instead of being a continuous 40 min crawl, horribly awkwardly cut apart by pointless scenes, there`s a more streamlined fight, and the whole climax with Yuki is shortened down and occurs AFTER SG is destroyed, and is significantly quicker. The big issue with the fight is how it intercuts scenes with Yuki and Co, and has this fakeout about SG exploding.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by edgaguirus »

Your climax sounds better than the one we got in the movie.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Rhedosaurus »

Just curious. After Mougera is destroyed and Godzilla blasts SpaceG with a Spiral Ray, one of the humans says "Spacegodzilla is dying!" How in the world does he know about that? It's not like Godzilla vs. Destroyah where I can believe that Des was suffering from serious internal injuries via him coughing up blood.

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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Gojirawars 03 »

UltramanGoji wrote:I’m curious why this one constantly ranks at the bottom of the series for others. I watched it today and it’s...really not that bad?

Bad effects? Well no, not really. The so-called “styrofoam asteroids” don’t even look like styrofoam and when you’re focused on the actions of SpaceG and Mogera, you don’t really pay attention to them. The rest of the film features pretty standard Heisei-era effects, nothing I can particularly call out as bad.

Bad characters? Again, not really. This might be the best movie for Miki Saegusa as she actually feels like a protagonist in this one (until Act 3) and the others are pretty alright as well. Yuki’s the standout, he’s got a solid arc (wonder how many people will get mad at that word being used) throughout the film and Akira Emoto does a good job in the role. Koji, though not the most interesting, is still not too bad to watch. Same goes for Kiyoshi, Chinatsu, and even the members of the UNGCC.

Bad story? Aside from the random Yakuza plot that I’ll agree has no relevance to the rest of the film, I don’t see what’s so bad. SpaceGodzilla’s origins might be a bit convoluted but he’s at least a monster with some personality and an interesting goal that we haven’t really seen from other space monsters before (colonizing the planet). I also really like the continuation of the psychic link between Miki and Godzilla and the subtle hints towards Godzilla's fate in the next movie.

Bad music? Well, not only do I disagree but I don’t think that’s really something to hate an entire movie over.

So yeah, chalk me down as one of the new fans of this one. I think it’s pretty fun.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by edgaguirus »

Rhedosaurus wrote:Just curious. After Mougera is destroyed and Godzilla blasts SpaceG with a Spiral Ray, one of the humans says "Spacegodzilla is dying!" How in the world does he know about that.
He was glowing red. When a signal or warning is red, it's usually a sign of danger or imminent death in movies and television.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Terasawa »

I watched this one today for the first time in a while, like really watched it (not just had it on while working on something else). Based on this one re-watch, I don't think it deserves the reputation it's earned -- that being that it's a horrible movie. It has a weak screenplay, a so-so score, and an inconsistent and sometimes frustrating pace, but I think some other aspects work really well.

The photography is excellent and the direction is --at worst-- competent. Even the FX cinematography, which I ragged on in another thread just the other day, is of a higher quality than in the two previous Godzillas. The final battle is pretty statically photographed but I think some of that blame belongs to the script (once again), which forces all of the action to center on the Fukuoka Tower. (It's hard to get a lot of coverage and diverse angles when you have a set than can only be shot one way without moving the entire cityscape or cyclorama background, if that makes sense.) Once the Tower is destroyed, the battle moves a little better and I think it's because it's not so obvious that everything is being shot from the same two or three angles. Aesthetically speaking, I don't like Kawakita's spark obsession or the dimly lit nighttime stages, but the SFX is about on par with its contemporaries. The composite shots are fantastic, though, just really excellent. (The making of special shows early digital compositing. I don't know if it was introduced into the series with this film or not.)

I don't even want to say the editing is bad: it's clear that they had to cut a lot of expository footage and the editor could only do so much to bring the rest of the movie together despite that, but otherwise it's no less competently edited than the other Heisei Godzilla movies. The first half of the movie chugs along at a good pace.

I guess the key words are "no less than," because I don't think the gulf between this movie and the other '90s Godzillas is so deep. It's just another average (or slightly less than average) Godzilla movie. Tonight I enjoyed this about as much as I normally do Godzilla vs. Mothra (another maligned Heisei movie I enjoy) and a touch more than I did Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla last night.

Some shots I like.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by LSD Jellyfish »

Terasawa wrote:Some shots I like.
Those are all really nice^^

I don't think any of the other Heisei films capture the ensuing chaos that the monsters cause as well as this^^

In that clip there's a great shot of looking at SG upwards from the ground and it's great.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Major sssspielberg! »

edgaguirus wrote:Your climax sounds better than the one we got in the movie.
LMAO
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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Major sssspielberg! wrote:
edgaguirus wrote:Your climax sounds better than the one we got in the movie.
LMAO
What is this LMAO directed at?
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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Ed hasn’t been active for about two months. Hope he’s doing all right.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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Kaiju-King42 wrote:
What is this LMAO directed at?
Phrasing
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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I remember loving this movie a lot as a child. Nowadays, I think it's an above average Godzilla movie.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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Wow, did I really just rewatch this film, exactly one year later by sheer coincidence? May 26th 2019 and 2020. Geez.

I think my view of the film has improved since my last viewing. The film does a good job at establishing SG as a threat, and there's enough showing him destroying things. I still think the stuff with Godzilla is a bit excessive. I don't think the final fight is as boring as I originally thought. I think it works well at switching up the targets during the fight from SG himself, to the tower, to the crystals and then just Godzilla finishing it off.

I think that the film also feels like one cohesive product throughout, mainly due to the characters, and how a lot of important stuff established on the island does in fact have an impact on the second half of the film. I'm 100% certain now that yes, Miki was controlling Godzilla to a degree throughout the later half of the film. We see her powers expanded on throughout the film, and have two moments where Godzilla is confirmed to be controlled by her. The cosmos thank Miki for saving the earth, right after removing the controller device. Yuki is well established and a lot of little moments like him hijacking Mougera, kamikazing with Mougera and then about to re-engage SG with a bazooka make sense.

One thing I noticed, which was probably intentional, was Yuki about to pull a Gondo. Both characters pull out a Bazooka with something that will presumably kill Godzilla/SpaceGodzilla. The ANEB/Blood Coagulant. Both characters, Gondo and Yuki, hate Godzilla (Yuki even more). The irony is that SG is about to kill Yuki, and Godzilla inadvertently saves him by firing off a beam at Space-Godzilla. That's why Yuki forgives him, and this is symbolized by him giving over presumably the last blood coagulant bullet towards the end. I also realized that Miki is a close stand-in to the Venusian in the Heisei series. Not exactly, but the whole dynamic of her in the lab is similar, and her talking to the cosmos to the shojibin.

I also really like a lot of the outfits in the film. A lot of the Heisei entries, sans Terasawa's red jacket in GVKG are really dull. Most of them are standard military uniforms, or explorer outfits. There's a lot of that here too, but I like the outfit Yuki wears when they infiltrate the crime syndicate. It gives a visual distinction from Kiyo and the other guy. Continuing both Miki and the other scientist, get these nice weird space jumpsuits that are weirdly reminiscent of the mysterians outfits towards the end. Probably a coincidence. I like Okubo's brief crazy mad-scientist get up.

I think that this film is also improved by the fact that KG in this continuity is not a space monster. Space-Godzilla is the only definitive alien in the Heisei series, and I think the mixture of powers he has makes him one of the strongest and threatening foes to Godzilla. With the exception of MG's G-Crusher, most Heisei monsters/weapons have only been able to restrain Godzilla, while dodging and briefly pushing him back. SG is the only monster that was straight up able to render Godzilla's beam completely useless, and pretty much tank everything with little effort, at least up until the help of Mougera and the destruction of the tower and crystals.

One final thing I want to mention is The Mysterians. Unlike Mothra, and King Ghidorah, I don't think this film was so overt at what it was referencing. However, I do think it's interesting how both The Mysterians and Space-Godzilla colonize earth and begin to terraform it. The climax revolves around a frontal offensive moving towards a base/tower and destroying it is key. This might not be intentional, but I thought it was interesting.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Terasawa »

I think the tropical island setting is a great and much needed change of scenery and pace for the Heisei Godzilla series.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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As I mentioned in another thread recently, I think this flick does a pretty decent job telling the story of Yuki and Shinjo coming to understand Godzilla as more than just an enemy to be fought.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Gigantis »

This film, if anything, is just "so bad it's good". Besides it introducing one of Godzilla's more infamous opponents and building up for the next movie, there's not really much with this film that makes it stand out, yet it is pretty fun to watch.

Also, the Project T subplot was absolutely pointless. You could cut it out and everything would be fine. It's the one thing i honestly hate about the movie.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by eabaker »

See, to me there's very little "so bad it's good" about this movie. A couple of the special effects, I guess, are amusingly bad.

But otherwise, you have a well-conceived story with largely poor plotting and pacing. The worst parts of this movie are more flat and boring than they are entertainingly bad.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

Post by Terasawa »

I’d like to know what was shot and cut because I think a lot of scenes could have been adjusted to make the plotting more efficient. As it is, you can tell the editor had a hard time keeping the movie at the standard 105±5 minute run time while keeping the story coherent. It seems that most of the cuts affect the Project T subplot; as with most of the later Godzilla movies, I’m sure another draft of the screenplay would have gone a long way towards improving the movie.
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Re: Godzilla vs SpaceGodzilla (1994)

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Terasawa wrote:It seems that most of the cuts affect the Project T subplot
Considering that the first human we see in the movie is Dr. Okubo, who is given a pretty dramatic reveal, it really feels like his character/storyline was supposed to be a lot more than the sloppy, minor late-second-act complication that it ended up as.

My first copy of this movie was a VHS boot with BITC of a version that I believe was slightly longer than the release. Unfortunately, I only watched it a couple of times before getting a subbed boot of the finished version, and I have no memory of what additions might have been in there (it can't have been anything too noteworthy, probably just bits that were tightened here and there). I wish I knew what happened to that tape...
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