The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

Post by szmigiel »

Again it comes down to the movies biggest failing, not explaining what "Removed from History" meant. Or in other words, other then Godzilla no longer being where he had been, what else in the world changed.

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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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I’m working on a YouTube video that I hope will clarify some of the more muddled aspects of the time travel.

I do think the movie mostly does a fair job explaining it, but there haven’t been any authentic translations yet that really do it justice. Although Wilson still says “erased from history”, otherwise the Japanese dialogue makes the effects of time travel much more explicit.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

Post by szmigiel »

I always like to hear from people who are native speakers, or with a good understanding, of the language on plot details that are a bit muddled in the dub or subtitled versions. I have always considered the Japanese versions as the definitive version of the films.

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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

Post by ShinGojira14 »

Heisei timeline explained:


Dinosaur lives on island.

America shoots living skreeonk out of dinosaur.

Time travelers teleport dinosaur UNDER DA SEE.

Russia gives dinosaur radioactive steroids.

Dinosaur goes on drug-induced rampage.

Humans time travel and skreeonk themselves in the arse.

Japan injects dinosaur with more steroids.

Local dinosaur is too angry to die.

Steroids causes dinosaur's body to go Chernobyl.

Dinosaur goes extinct.



Take that, you dinosaur.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Alright, ignore this post, the bot and his shady links that were once above this post have been deleted.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Terasawa wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:08 am I’m working on a YouTube video that I hope will clarify some of the more muddled aspects of the time travel.

I do think the movie mostly does a fair job explaining it, but there haven’t been any authentic translations yet that really do it justice. Although Wilson still says “erased from history”, otherwise the Japanese dialogue makes the effects of time travel much more explicit.
Good luck on that. The Omni Viewer did a video that debunked pretty every conceivable defence one could make for the film.

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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

Post by Terasawa »

Wikizilla: "...the Futurians' actions simply created a new timeline where Godzilla was created by a nuclear submarine crash. Contrary to what our original video explaining the time travel stated, the Futurians did actually create a new timeline where a submarine crash in the Bering Sea turned the Godzillasaurus into Godzilla, rather than the CASTLE BRAVO H-bomb test. This information comes from the official theater program for GODZILLA VS. KING GHIDORAH, which lays out the film's branching timelines."
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Terasawa wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:10 am Wikizilla: "...the Futurians' actions simply created a new timeline where Godzilla was created by a nuclear submarine crash. Contrary to what our original video explaining the time travel stated, the Futurians did actually create a new timeline where a submarine crash in the Bering Sea turned the Godzillasaurus into Godzilla, rather than the CASTLE BRAVO H-bomb test. This information comes from the official theater program for GODZILLA VS. KING GHIDORAH, which lays out the film's branching timelines."
Right, also thanks for citing us. We are guilty of perpetuating the flawed stable time loop explanation in the past, but new information has since come to light that presents a slightly more complex reality. The way we at Wikizilla understand it, there are three branching timelines in the film, which I will try to explain here.

Timeline 1: The H-bomb irradiates and awakens the first Godzilla in 1954. He is killed by the Oxygen Destroyer after destroying Tokyo. The H-bomb also mutates the Godzillasaurus on Lagos Island into a second Godzilla, who attacks Tokyo 30 years later, Godzilla is trapped in Mt. Mihara, then escapes in 1990 and battles Biollante. Godzilla is infected by the Anti-Nuclear Energy Bacteria and is forced to hibernate in the sea. Godzilla never returns to Japan, which prospers and becomes the most powerful nation on Earth by 2204. The Futurians, wanting to curb Japan's power, travel back in time to 1992.

Timeline 2: The Godzillasaurus on Lagos Island is moved to the Bering Sea; in his place three Dorats are left behind on the island. In 1954, the H-bomb mutates the three Dorats into King Ghidorah. The same H-bomb still awakens the first Godzilla, who attacks Tokyo and is killed by the Oxygen Destroyer. Sometime later, a nuclear submarine crashes in the Bering Sea and mutates the dormant Godzillasaurus into the second Godzilla. He attacks Japan in 1984/85, then battles Biollante and is infected by the ANEB, returning to the ocean to keep the ANEB from killing him. In 1992, the Japanese government, mistakenly believing the unmutated Godzillasaurus is still in the Bering Sea, sends a nuclear submarine to mutate him into Godzilla. Instead, the sub encounters the ANEB-weakened Godzilla, who feeds on its energy, curing his ANEB infection and causing him to grow from 80 to 100 meters in height. Godzilla comes ashore and defeats King Ghidorah and the Futurians, then goes on a rampage that by 2204 has resulted in Japan's destruction.

Timeline 3: Emmy Kano and M11 salvage King Ghidorah's comatose body in 2204 and transform it into Mecha-King Ghidorah, then travel back to 1992 to stop Godzilla's rampage. They succeed in dumping Godzilla into the sea and ending his rampage, then return to 2204.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Terasawa wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:10 am Wikizilla: "...the Futurians' actions simply created a new timeline where Godzilla was created by a nuclear submarine crash. Contrary to what our original video explaining the time travel stated, the Futurians did actually create a new timeline where a submarine crash in the Bering Sea turned the Godzillasaurus into Godzilla, rather than the CASTLE BRAVO H-bomb test. This information comes from the official theater program for GODZILLA VS. KING GHIDORAH, which lays out the film's branching timelines."
That there definitely sure is one way to vastly overcomplicate what is a solid causal loop.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:18 am That there definitely sure is one way to vastly overcomplicate what is a solid causal loop.
It's not a causal loop, though, and it was never supposed to be one. That's just an incorrect interpretation that spread through the fandom because it was a lot easier to understand than what the movie posits.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Terasawa wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:38 am
NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:18 am That there definitely sure is one way to vastly overcomplicate what is a solid causal loop.
It's not a causal loop, though, and it was never supposed to be one. That's just an incorrect interpretation that spread through the fandom because it was a lot easier to understand than what the movie posits.
I'll concede to that, but it still feels like making something more complicated that doesn't need to be. Nothing actually changes by relocating the dinosaur, so having that be an actual shift feels superfluous and uneeded. Having Godzilla's rampage in the third act suddenly be the one that literally destroys the country nearly comes off as ridiculous as there's nothing that sets it apart from the ones before, and it's goofy to think the simple act of carrying him out to sea would actually alter anything of that apparent severe magnitude, and if it is indeed that simple, then we're back at square one of the ridiculous notion of this rampage being Japan's absolute ruin.

Goddamn, the writing in this movie is a joke.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:10 am
Terasawa wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:38 am
NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:18 am That there definitely sure is one way to vastly overcomplicate what is a solid causal loop.
It's not a causal loop, though, and it was never supposed to be one. That's just an incorrect interpretation that spread through the fandom because it was a lot easier to understand than what the movie posits.
I'll concede to that, but it still feels like making something more complicated that doesn't need to be. Nothing actually changes by relocating the dinosaur, so having that be an actual shift feels superfluous and uneeded. Having Godzilla's rampage in the third act suddenly be the one that literally destroys the country nearly comes off as ridiculous as there's nothing that sets it apart from the ones before, and it's goofy to think the simple act of carrying him out to sea would actually alter anything of that apparent severe magnitude, and if it is indeed that simple, then we're back at square one of the ridiculous notion of this rampage being Japan's absolute ruin.

Goddamn, the writing in this movie is a joke.
Just wanted to let you know it's spelled "unneeded".

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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:10 am I'll concede to that, but it still feels like making something more complicated that doesn't need to be. Nothing actually changes by relocating the dinosaur, so having that be an actual shift feels superfluous and uneeded. Having Godzilla's rampage in the third act suddenly be the one that literally destroys the country nearly comes off as ridiculous as there's nothing that sets it apart from the ones before, and it's goofy to think the simple act of carrying him out to sea would actually alter anything of that apparent severe magnitude, and if it is indeed that simple, then we're back at square one of the ridiculous notion of this rampage being Japan's absolute ruin.

Goddamn, the writing in this movie is a joke.
Relocating the dinosaur is what creates Ghidorah. It's also necessary to make the point that the creation of Godzilla is inevitable, one of the film's many thematic concepts.

Furthermore, the idea is that Japan can't stop Godzilla after his "rebirth," which is why Emmy travels to the future to create a weapon that can. Godzilla begins his rampage in Hokkaido and travels south to Tokyo. It doesn't seem that he travels by land the entire way, but still, that's a rampage--very little of which we see because of how the film is paced, by the way--that spans roughly two-thirds of Japan. Couple that with what King Ghidorah did in Kyushu and you have an utterly ravaged nation. If there's a mistake there, it's simply that we don't see more damage.

Since Japan is able to begin its rebuild by having MKG deposit Godzilla in the Pacific, the implication would be that, had Emmy not intervened, Godzilla's rampage would have continued indefinitely.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Terasawa wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:12 pm
NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:10 am I'll concede to that, but it still feels like making something more complicated that doesn't need to be. Nothing actually changes by relocating the dinosaur, so having that be an actual shift feels superfluous and uneeded. Having Godzilla's rampage in the third act suddenly be the one that literally destroys the country nearly comes off as ridiculous as there's nothing that sets it apart from the ones before, and it's goofy to think the simple act of carrying him out to sea would actually alter anything of that apparent severe magnitude, and if it is indeed that simple, then we're back at square one of the ridiculous notion of this rampage being Japan's absolute ruin.

Goddamn, the writing in this movie is a joke.
Relocating the dinosaur is what creates Ghidorah. It's also necessary to make the point that the creation of Godzilla is inevitable, one of the film's many thematic concepts.

Furthermore, the idea is that Japan can't stop Godzilla after his "rebirth," which is why Emmy travels to the future to create a weapon that can. Godzilla begins his rampage in Hokkaido and travels south to Tokyo. It doesn't seem that he travels by land the entire way, but still, that's a rampage--very little of which we see because of how the film is paced, by the way--that spans roughly two-thirds of Japan. Couple that with what King Ghidorah did in Kyushu and you have an utterly ravaged nation. If there's a mistake there, it's simply that we don't see more damage.

Since Japan is able to begin its rebuild by having MKG deposit Godzilla in the Pacific, the implication would be that, had Emmy not intervened, Godzilla's rampage would have continued indefinitely.
I suppose you make a good point with that. Definitely could've been more clear about it in the actual movie, but it is what it is, I guess.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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I love this movie but I'll be the first to admit that narrative clarity is not one of its strengths. Also, as with just about every other Shogo Tomiyama Godzilla film (1989-2004), there's simply too much material for the targeted 105~ minute runtime.

But, that said, I really appreciate Omori's ambition with this film. I think it ultimately gets more right than wrong, but it's certainly a struggle for the viewer to piece it all together the way Omori probably intended. It's a frustrating movie, I know. But it made for one hell of a rewarding experience when it finally clicked for me.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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The sad thing is that the old time loop explanation actually patched up some of this movie's godawful writing. Now that it's debunked, we're back to square one: where nothing in the movie makes any fucking sense at all.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Kaiju-King42 wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:54 pm The sad thing is that the old time loop explanation actually patched up some of this movie's godawful writing. Now that it's debunked, we're back to square one: where nothing in the movie makes any fucking sense at all.
Dunno what else to tell you because there are more fans of this movie besides just me who get it. :shrug:
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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Kaiju-King42 wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:54 pm The sad thing is that the old time loop explanation actually patched up some of this movie's godawful writing. Now that it's debunked, we're back to square one: where nothing in the movie makes any skreeonking sense at all.
Where did it get debunked?

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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

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NSZ wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:10 am Having Godzilla's rampage in the third act suddenly be the one that literally destroys the country nearly comes off as ridiculous as there's nothing that sets it apart from the ones before
Except that Godzilla is explicitly larger and more powerful now than he ever has been before.
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Re: The Heisei Timeline Explained

Post by King of the Monsters »

LegendZilla wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:20 pm
Kaiju-King42 wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:54 pm The sad thing is that the old time loop explanation actually patched up some of this movie's godawful writing. Now that it's debunked, we're back to square one: where nothing in the movie makes any skreeonking sense at all.
Where did it get debunked?
It's debunked by the movie itself. Emmy says to Terasawa that Japan is a superpower by 2204 and Godzilla never recovered from the ANEB. Then later she and Morrys mention that Japan was destroyed by Godzilla after he defeated King Ghidorah, meaning the future was changed by their time tampering. Emmy stops this future with Mecha-King Ghidorah, but the in the current timeline Godzilla still recovered from the ANEB. So that's three different timelines right there, meaning it's impossible for it to all be one big time loop.

Furthermore, the film's official theater program and Super Complete Works book both provide the same explanation, laying out three branching timelines.

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