Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Jeff-Goldblum2 wrote:What does the line " inside each one of us" supposed to mean?
Ask Bill Cosby the same question and you'll get your answer.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Jeff-Goldblum2 wrote:What does the line "Godzilla is inside each one of us" supposed to mean?
It's an attempt to directly translate the Japanese line there. Which, based on the subtitles on the Sony DVD, I take to mean something along the lines of, "As scientists, the responsibility for Godzilla lies with each one of us."

In essence, because the gains in knowledge and the atomic bomb that science made possible was the kind of thing that birthed Godzilla, everyone in the field that has done that kind of research or benefited from the research done in the past has a small share in the responsibility of those whose reckless use of science created Godzilla.

But it kind of loses that context in the English rendering. :)
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by Godzilla165 »

Like Zarm said, the Japanese dub of that line makes a lot more sense and adds weight to the scene; the whole sequence is more powerful than its English counterpart. It’s one of the very few instances where I prefer the original Japanese version of a scene in 2000 to the English one.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by Jeff-Goldblum2 »

Just reading the English translation of the Japanese version of the line makes 10,000 times more sense.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Zarm wrote:
Jeff-Goldblum2 wrote:What does the line "Godzilla is inside each one of us" supposed to mean?
It's an attempt to directly translate the Japanese line there. Which, based on the subtitles on the Sony DVD, I take to mean something along the lines of, "As scientists, the responsibility for Godzilla lies with each one of us."

In essence, because the gains in knowledge and the atomic bomb that science made possible was the kind of thing that birthed Godzilla, everyone in the field that has done that kind of research or benefited from the research done in the past has a small share in the responsibility of those whose reckless use of science created Godzilla.

But it kind of loses that context in the English rendering. :)
Just watched it again, and with my moderate understanding of Japanese I wanted to add something:

Glasses guy says,”omae wa naze arawanderu?” Or “Why did you appear.

Right before Shinoda says those lines, Ichinose, the female character, says,”Humans gave birth to Godzilla” or something along those lines. I believe the subs make it created, which also works, but the idea and sentiment in that scene makes sense.

“gojira wa oretachi naka ni ireunda”.

Okay, so anyways, I watched the film and I noticed some things I never noticed, which makes the film more interesting:

-It’s subtle, but the CCI, are not originally looking for the ship. They are there to essentially probe the geothermal vents to see if a new source of energy can be made. It’s very relevant, because in a strange roundabout way, the milennian now also works as a foil to Godzilla who presumably is caused by humanities nuclear/energy consumption.

-Something that might be me reaching, is that the Millenian ship...might be a reference to King Ghidorah? The scene where they discover the ship, is similar to the sub scene in Godzilla vs King Ghidorah, where they discover Ghidorah’s head. Additionally, for like a few seconds, you can hear a harp theme. Ghidorah In 91 was accompanied by a harp. Additionally, similar to Ghidorah in GTTHM, both monsters are from space, locked in some sort of meteorite/ship, that has unusual effects on the world around them.

-The bombs used to blow up the building, were originally intended to be used on Godzilla in the middle of the film. Again it’s easy to miss, but the plan was to detonate them if Godzilla got too close to the reactor, make him fall over and then kill him. It was always sort of weird how they had these random special bombs ready to blow up orga but they had them right away.

-The millenians, are made of gas/liquid. Actually, I can’t 100% confirm it, but it’s the theory put forward by Shinoda and is visually confirmed. Basically, they’re gaseous creatures that can come together in a liquid form....I think. It’s why when they drain Godzilla of info, they’re transparent. It’s also why they before the tentacles appear, you can’t see them extending from the ship. The film sort of alludes to this, but it’s also why they desire a physical form in that of Godzilla.

-I never realized how much of a threat The Millenians were. It’s not really something that’s emphasized, and it’s easy to miss, but the millenian ship was in the process of changing Tokyo to suit their needs. When Shinoda is in the building, he covers his mouth to protect his breathing. The millenians were sending some strange tentacles/apparatus throughout the city to terraform the city to their needs. The millenian ship could also theoretically disable all communication and other nasty things. The film doesn’t really build the ship up as some world ending catastrophe, but it totally was.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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LSD Jellyfish wrote:Okay, so anyways, I watched the film and I noticed some things I never noticed, which makes the film more interesting
People like to endlessly praise the Mike Schlesinger version of Godzilla 2000 'cause it's supposedly "the version Toho prefers".

Sure, some of the visual and audio editing help the film, but did they really need to needlessly jettison so much helpful exposition?
You get a more polished post-production feel at the expense of a coherent story.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Space Hunter M wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:Okay, so anyways, I watched the film and I noticed some things I never noticed, which makes the film more interesting
People like to endlessly praise the Mike Schlesinger version of Godzilla 2000 'cause it's supposedly "the version Toho prefers".

Sure, some of the visual and audio editing help the film, but did they really need to needlessly jettison so much helpful exposition?
You get a more polished post-production feel at the expense of a coherent story.
Yeah, I don’t get it now.

I prefer Orga’s roar in the Japanese version, because yes while less threatening, it fits the weirdness of the monster well and sounds a little tragic. Additionally, orga makes some strange clicks, that might be it communicating or controlling the UFO.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.
Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I understand the removal of the Millennium subplot. That stuff was instantly dated on 1/1/2000. I wonder if the other simplifications were done to tailor the film to an American audience that expects a very basic monster vs. monster story from a Godzilla film.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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LSD Jellyfish wrote: Yeah, I don’t get it now.

I prefer Orga’s roar in the Japanese version, because yes while less threatening, it fits the weirdness of the monster well and sounds a little tragic. Additionally, orga makes some strange clicks, that might be it communicating or controlling the UFO.
Yeah, bits like that... There's a lot of subtlety that was also steamrolled out of the Schlesinger cut.

Some of the sound design in the Toho cut is weaker, but a lot of it is a lot more atmospheric and doesn't bludgeon you over the head.

Added in 2 minutes 6 seconds:
Terasawa wrote:I understand the removal of the Millennium subplot. That stuff was instantly dated on 1/1/2000. I wonder if the other simplifications were done to tailor the film to an American audience that expects a very basic monster vs. monster story from a Godzilla film.
They were also working with the export dub as the skeleton of the looping script, and only resorting to the Japanese when something seemed really out of place, so that's probably another factor in the telephone game-y style of writing some parts of the Schlesinger cut has.

I wonder why they cut out the "oxygen content" bit though. In the commentary, Mike and the others are about to talk about it, but the recording suddenly cuts.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Space Hunter M wrote:Some of the sound design in the Toho cut is weaker, but a lot of it is a lot more atmospheric and doesn't bludgeon you over the head.
Your use of the phrase "bludgeon you over the head" immediately made me think of that terrible comedy music cue they inserted in the scene where the guy keeps getting whacked in the noggin.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Terasawa wrote:I understand the removal of the Millennium subplot. That stuff was instantly dated on 1/1/2000. I wonder if the other simplifications were done to tailor the film to an American audience that expects a very basic monster vs. monster story from a Godzilla film.
I disagree as overeliance on technology and the risk of cyber circuity is still a big issue. The film definitely could have done more with that though.

Another cool detail I noticed, is just how awesome and well designed the Millenian ship, the Millenian and Orga all are...together(not separately). When the Millenian ship lands on the tower, and extends its tentacles downwards, there’s a screenshot that shows that if the UFO was the” head”, the body would be the tower, and then the tentacles extending outwards. In other words the Millenians design is sort of hinted at before its unveiled.

I also realized on this viewing how much I wish the UFO and Millenian came back, in addition to Orga. Half of the fight is really Godzilla versus the UFO, who actually with the tentacles has a decent grip on Godzilla. The Millenian prior to becoming Orga is actually one of the most unique monsters in the franchise.

Also I realized how quality wise this film is varied on cinematography. When Godzilla attacks Nemuro, there’s some really fantastic lighting, that give Godzilla this really ominous feeling similar to G54.
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Fri Oct 11, 2019 4:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.
Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I think a lot of the cuts were honestly just for pacing. I agree that the expanded information in the Japanese cut of the film adds a lot of depth- but the story doesn't really flow. I feel like a lot of the cuts were honestly to give energy and flow to the film; in my experience, the Japanese version was lethargic, and a bit more of a chore to get through, despite the added interest of exapnded worldbuilding.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Zarm wrote:I think a lot of the cuts were honestly just for pacing. I agree that the expanded information in the Japanese cut of the film adds a lot of depth- but the story doesn't really flow. I feel like a lot of the cuts were honestly to give energy and flow to the film; in my experience, the Japanese version was lethargic, and a bit more of a chore to get through, despite the added interest of exapnded worldbuilding.
the film, both versions, really doesn't have a pacing issue in terms of exposition or dialogue, especially anything aforementioned. The issue was the decision to make the UFO "re-stagnate" and land after it first appears, and the whole tower sequence.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.
Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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LSD Jellyfish wrote:
Terasawa wrote:I understand the removal of the Millennium subplot. That stuff was instantly dated on 1/1/2000. I wonder if the other simplifications were done to tailor the film to an American audience that expects a very basic monster vs. monster story from a Godzilla film.
I disagree as overeliance on technology and the risk of cyber circuity is still a big issue. The film definitely could have done more with that though.
I'm actually referring to the "Millennium Kingdom" stuff that comes up when the aliens announce their intent with the takeover of Tokyo's computer systems. In the audio commentary, Schlesinger actually points out that they removed that stuff because by the time the U.S. version was released, the mystique of the new millennium had already long since passed.

In other words, it was basically just the word "millennium" on its own that the U.S. producers felt would immediately date the film. I think that was probably the right decision in August, 2000; if the film were Americanized today I bet they'd leave that in.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Terasawa wrote:
LSD Jellyfish wrote:
Terasawa wrote:I understand the removal of the Millennium subplot. That stuff was instantly dated on 1/1/2000. I wonder if the other simplifications were done to tailor the film to an American audience that expects a very basic monster vs. monster story from a Godzilla film.
I disagree as overeliance on technology and the risk of cyber circuity is still a big issue. The film definitely could have done more with that though.
I'm actually referring to the "Millennium Kingdom" stuff that comes up when the aliens announce their intent with the takeover of Tokyo's computer systems. In the audio commentary, Schlesinger actually points out that they removed that stuff because by the time the U.S. version was released, the mystique of the new millennium had already long since passed.

In other words, it was basically just the word "millennium" on its own that the U.S. producers felt would immediately date the film. I think that was probably the right decision in August, 2000; if the film were Americanized today I bet they'd leave that in.
Yes the word "Millennium" certainly would date the film...unlike the word 2000. :lol:
Last edited by LSD Jellyfish on Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
_JNavs_ wrote:The MV is like cheap imitation crabmeat, it tastes good, but it isn't real, while Shin is kino peak Japanese performance.
Rodan95 wrote:The Shobijin are sat on by a fatass explorer and killed. Mothra is pissed and destroys Japan.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by Gojira9310 »

I wonder if anyone's tried to make a fan edit of the Japanese version that gives it the pace and energy of the US Cut, but without the dubbing? It'd certainly be interesting to see.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by SoggyNoodles2016 »

Film officially turns 20 today, so decided to share my thoughts

I skreeonking love 2000 so much.

Is it the most powerful Godzilla film, a genre defying classic like Shin or 54? No.

However, 2000 to me is just perfect for what it is: a classic Godzilla story done exceedingly well. It is formula but it's one of the best executions of the formula, innovating new ideas for every one it brings back. The characters are all amazing. The human ones shine as people in a world of monsters, a refreshingly down to earth portrayal compared to the agents of super organizations and military men that would come before and since. The kaiju are also incredibly well done. The Millenians are by and far the best execution of an alien antagonist in the series. They excude a silence, unknowable menace in the UFO before becoming a tragic terror once they become Orga. And finally, as for the "dreaded god" himself, this Godzilla is the standard for all Godzillas for me. A mysterious creature of unknown origins and alignment, both a creature science can understand and a mysterious god acting on whims we can't understand.

2000 not only shows what a Godzilla film can be, it reminds us in that iconic finale, as Godzilla saves mankind and then instantly burns down it's works, what Godzilla is.

2000 was the second film I saw and the one that truly made me love this series, and think about it as more then just the monster battles younger me associated it with.

So, for that, I wish it a fond anniversary
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:The characters are all amazing. The human ones shine as people in a world of monsters, a refreshingly down to earth portrayal compared to the agents of super organizations and military men that would come before and since.
This is the only Godzilla movie where I've ever walked away wishing that the central characters had been given more movies to interact in together. The dynamics among Shinoda, Miyasaka and Katagiri are really interesting, and I'd have loved to see a trilogy that really explored the motives of all three, and the way that Miysaka is torn between the other two's perspectives.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I've been wondering what was so weird about the Japanese version that throws me off vs. the american version. I think it's the sound. there are some scenes where Godzilla's stomping around and you hear music and then... nothing... It's awkward. Still love this movie. Still looks and feels like a much bigger film than the other millenium, and Heisei, films.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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It's my first theater Godzilla film.

GINO doesn't count.
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