Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Chrispy_G
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by Chrispy_G »

eabaker wrote:
SoggyNoodles2016 wrote:The characters are all amazing. The human ones shine as people in a world of monsters, a refreshingly down to earth portrayal compared to the agents of super organizations and military men that would come before and since.
This is the only Godzilla movie where I've ever walked away wishing that the central characters had been given more movies to interact in together. The dynamics among Shinoda, Miyasaka and Katagiri are really interesting, and I'd have loved to see a trilogy that really explored the motives of all three, and the way that Miysaka is torn between the other two's perspectives.
Absolutely, I've always felt that the character dynamics in this film were the most strongly drawn. To me, it feels so much like what could have been a BEGINNING....like, to see Shinoda, Io, Yuki, and Miyasaka develop over 2 more films would have been interesting. Even to do a Gamera-Trilogy-esque thing where maybe they played co-starring, or even supporting roles to new characters that came in.

With or without the enhanced US Sound Design...something about G2K always feels a bit more cinematic than anything from the 90s or 00s. Anything since Biollante. I always pretend the film is a ghost-sequel to Biollante ANYWAYS.

I saw G98 in a theater, and G2K was the first Toho movie I saw in theaters....maybe seeing it in that way is what makes it feel so grand in my memory.

I always wanted more of this one though. I would have loved to see the G2K design be used for a trilogy of films and become as distinct and known as the Heisei Design.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by Terasawa »

This movie is a real snoozer after that first Godzilla/UFO battle. :/ I also really don't like Takayuki Hattori's score at all. I hate the weak instrumentation most of all but the compositions don't fit anything on the screen.

I hate to say it but I like G2K less every time I watch it.
Last edited by Terasawa on Sat May 02, 2020 1:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by HedorahIsBestGirl »

Terasawa wrote:This movie is a real snoozer after that first Godzilla/UFO battle. :/ I also really don't like Takayuki Hattori's score at all. I hate the weak instrumentation most of all but the compositions don't fit anything on the screen.

I hate to say it but I like G2K less every time I watch it.
That's too bad. The same thing happens to me every time I watch Godzilla vs. Destoroyah, but I still enjoy G2K.

I really enjoy Shinoda's character and his father/daughter dynamic with Io. I also enjoy his rivalry with Katagiri. That's enough to hold my attention. I agree that the movie drags a bit after the Godzilla/UFO battle, but it picks back up before I get really bored. To be honest, I find G2K more consistently engaging than all but two of the Heisei films, those being Biollante and MG2, and I still favor it over both of those films.

I have to admit, the score is one of the series' weakest. Personally, I prefer it to the scores for the Kiryu duology, but I'm aware that's a very unpopular opinion. Otherwise, it's pretty much bottom of the barrel for the series' music.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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HedorahIsBestGirl wrote:
Terasawa wrote:This movie is a real snoozer after that first Godzilla/UFO battle. :/ I also really don't like Takayuki Hattori's score at all. I hate the weak instrumentation most of all but the compositions don't fit anything on the screen.

I hate to say it but I like G2K less every time I watch it.
That's too bad. The same thing happens to me every time I watch Godzilla vs. Destoroyah, but I still enjoy G2K.

I really enjoy Shinoda's character and his father/daughter dynamic with Io. I also enjoy his rivalry with Katagiri. That's enough to hold my attention. I agree that the movie drags a bit after the Godzilla/UFO battle, but it picks back up before I get really bored. To be honest, I find G2K more consistently engaging than all but two of the Heisei films, those being Biollante and MG2, and I still favor it over both of those films.
Lately I've found that I really prefer the concept of those characters and relationships to what we get in the movie. For example, movie Katagiri has virtually no humanizing characteristics: he's just a colossal jerk. Any positive or even ambiguous elements of his character are basically limited to lip service. I do like Hiroshi Abe a lot and I think he does the best he can with what he was given...

Speaking of Shinoda and Io, the father/daughter track is Hattori's best for the film. Some of the compositions (Godzilla's theme, the Full Metal Missile strike) are cool but I don't think they work well with the accompanying visuals.
I have to admit, the score is one of the series' weakest. Personally, I prefer it to the scores for the Kiryu duology, but I'm aware that's a very unpopular opinion. Otherwise, it's pretty much bottom of the barrel for the series' music.
I'm not too high on Oshima's Godzilla scores either but I think the one that was recorded with the Moscow Symphonic Orchestra (GXMG) has incredible power. I don't play that soundtrack or movie very often but it always impresses me. IMO the GFW score is the series' worst. Godzilla Raids Again is down there, too.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Terasawa wrote:Lately I've found that I really prefer the concept of those characters and relationships to what we get in the movie. For example, movie Katagiri has virtually no humanizing characteristics: he's just a colossal jerk. Any positive or even ambiguous elements of his character are basically limited to lip service. I do like Hiroshi Abe a lot and I think he does the best he can with what he was given...
Yeah, at the time, I was really drawn to the Shinoda/Miyasaka/Katagiri dynamic, but I walked out of the theater thinking those character relationships could have played out across a trilogy. They represent my favorite aspect of the movie, which I do overall enjoy a fair amoung, but there's definitely a missed opportunity there.
HedorahIsBestGirl wrote:
I have to admit, the score is one of the series' weakest. Personally, I prefer it to the scores for the Kiryu duology, but I'm aware that's a very unpopular opinion. Otherwise, it's pretty much bottom of the barrel for the series' music.
I'm not too high on Oshima's Godzilla scores either but I think the one that was recorded with the Moscow Symphonic Orchestra (GXMG) has incredible power. I don't play that soundtrack or movie very often but it always impresses me. IMO the GFW score is the series' worst. Godzilla Raids Again is down there, too.
Agreed on pretty much all of these points. I find Hattori's score for G2K to be passable, functional, but thoroughly unremarkable (I'd say the same about the GRA score). I like Oshima's work, but it's all very generic, never feeling specific to the scenes/story; you could take her Godzilla scores and apply them to pretty much any action/adventure movie, and they'd fit equally well.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

Post by The One and Only »

On the subject of Hatorri's score. I quite enjoyed it. Much better than what he put together in 1994 for GODZILLA Vs. SPACE GODZILLA. In that flick it always came off weird ,and misplaced like it just didn't fit in. It had some good spots. Like at the beginning with Space G going through space towards Earth, and the building of Moguera. But honestly it just didn't work. I can't help but be reminded of Christopher Stone's score from A NIGHTMARE ON ELM STREET 2:Freddy's Revenge ! when thinking of Space G. But his music just seems to fit 2000 better all around. At least for me.

Also, I watched G-2000 last night ,and noticed when Shindo and Io are getting dinner ready in one scene. There's some thing playing in the background. Never really noticed it before ,just thought it was a news report playing, or a documentary. I guess in the American version Michael Schlesinger, the writer, editor charged with dubbing it for an American audience decided to add another nod to American sci-fi classics by having played in the background the Ray Harryhausen classic, EARTH Vs. THE FLYING SAUCERS !, If you have a decent sound system you can hear the characters from the flick when they're talking to aliens in the film. Just thought I should share that with you.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Interesting. I'll try to see if I can hear that.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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So I watched Wakasa's interview last night and am a bit confused, hoping someone can clarify. So Wakasa, Sakai, and Nishikawa all had a hand in creating this design? Does anyone know who created the first version? I know Sakai's version was tweaked for the film.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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shadowgigan wrote:So I watched Wakasa's interview last night and am a bit confused, hoping someone can clarify. So Wakasa, Sakai, and Nishikawa all had a hand in creating this design? Does anyone know who created the first version? I know Sakai's version was tweaked for the film.
I always thought Nishikawa drew the initial concept, Sakai made a maquette based off of it, but the suit took some serious liberties with the maquette design and turned into how it appears in the movie.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Wikizilla has some concept art of the Godzilla design, credited to Yuji Sakai. One of these is a silhouette of (approximately) the final design. Wakasa is a suit builder but I don't know if he was involved in the early concept design phase, and I'm not sure how Nishikawa fits in, either.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Terasawa wrote:Wikizilla has some concept art of the Godzilla design, credited to Yuji Sakai. One of these is a silhouette of (approximately) the final design. Wakasa is a suit builder but I don't know if he was involved in the early concept design phase, and I'm not sure how Nishikawa fits in, either.
If you're referring to this one...
https://wikizilla.org/wiki/Godzilla_200 ... illa_2.png

That's Nishikawa. Looks like their notations are a bit outdated. Y'all really making me take out my Nishikawa drawing book?! :)

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According to Nishikawa, the three designs on the left (A, B, C descending) are what he drew up first. The ones on the right are various combinations of the three on the left. I think the decided design here was the one on the upper right, which primarily mixed the spines of A and the body of B, and also appears on the Japanese poster.
https://wikizilla.org/w/images/2/24/God ... Poster.jpg

Here's Sakai's sculpt based on the silhouette.
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Couldn't tell you how early on Wakasa may've gotten involved, though.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Ok, seems like Wakasa probably just took the final design and make the suit. In the interview he said it was "all Nishikawa" for the most part. So it probably went Nishikawa's design --> Sakai's Marquette --> Wakasa's Suit.

I need to get that Nishikawa book.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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GigaBowserG wrote: If you're referring to this one...
That's the one, thanks for the correction.

I've always liked Sakai's sculpt. Too bad Wakasa built the costumes.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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Watched the Japanese version for the first time today. I know it's widely seen as the inferior version, but outside of a few soundscape differences, I honestly found it to be just as good as the TriStar version. There's undoubtedly some bias in this as G2K is one of my favorite Godzilla movies, but there weren't any moments where I really felt I should be watching the TriStar version instead. It felt pretty much the same, outside of those aformentioned soundscape differences.

The Japanese version actually has some sound design differences that I prefer, such as the sounds (or lack thereof) of the UFO. The TriStar version's overly science fictiony noises really pale in comparison to the ominous humming in the Japanese version.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I don't think there's really anything wrong with either version of the film, they're both suitable for their intended audiences. The original version feels much more like a Japanese flick while the TriStar cut feels (and sounds) much more like a Hollywood movie. The best thing TriStar did was remove some SFX blunders that made it into the final (Japanese) cut. Other than that, I actually think the TriStar sound mix is a typically overwhelming Hollywood job. The new music is irritating and doesn't blend well with Hattori's score. I don't really like either version of the film, but when I do watch it, I've come to prefer the experience of the Japanese version.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I have seen both versions and both are decent overall. Not much to stand out from the crowd but not bad either.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I always wondered why the suit didn't really look like the concept.

I definitely would have preferred the Nishikawa/Sakai design over Wakasa's, but the final product wasn't bad, so whatever.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I might be wrong, but I think the fins from the beta designs made their way into Orga's metamophosizing form.

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Note how "downwards facing" they are. G2K's spines go directly back, while Orga's start to spiral downwards.

Orga is such a weird monster because it essentially has three forms, but no one ever really talks about the "Godzillafied" form.
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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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This film is underrated. Orga is really awesome and the new look for Godzilla is great.

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Re: Talkback: Godzilla 2000 Millennium (1999)

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I myself am quite fond of G'2000 on a sentimental level as my father taking a very young me to see it in theaters is actually the very first time I have a clear recollection of seeing a movie in theaters. It's certainly flawed and I agree with some others' sentiments that it seems to be a very middle of the road kind of Godzilla movie. Still, for a rush job the fact it's decent is kinda commendable. I do genuinely like the setting and characters and wish we got to see more of it develop. It's one reason why I distinctly dislike the Millennium era for the constant reboots as aside from GMK and 2000, none of them actually made good use of that reboot opportunity.
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