Your favorite Toho Showa *Non-G* SCI-FI FILM

[Dogbert]

Kong escapes, with gargqnruas as a close second.

[Dust_pan]

Sadly, I've only seen a few of the listed films (Mostly the giant monster ones). But of the films I've seen, Matango has to be my top favorite. I love the characters and their interactions, the eerie atmosphere, the profound ending, and the simple fact that it features mushroom monsters, because fungi are some of the coolest organisms on earth.

I'm interested in checking out more movies in that list, so it's possible that I will have a new favorite in the future.

[JGAR]

Rodan, that was a Toho classic and a great introduction to one of Toho's biggest mascots.

[Tyrant_Lizard_King]

Frankenstein Conquers the World followed closely by Rodan

[Beef Bigshot]

Uh rodan, for sure. The movie is genuenly creepy even when you have no more meganulon. The begining of the film starts out completly different then you think. It's suspenseful and makes you forget this is about a giant flying dinosaur. Honestly I remember when I first saw it, my mind was blown.

It's on about the same level as gojira for me because the yone and drama are so good

[Dogbert]

I change mine to rodan

[Rodan]

For the record, I'm coloring the ones I've seen in red:

• The Invisible Man
• Half Human
• Rodan
• The Mysterians
• H-Man
• Battle in Outer Space
• Varan (Japanese cut)
• The Human Vapor
• The Secret of the Telegian
• Birth of Japan (aka The Three Treasures)
• The Last War
• Mothra
• Gorath
• Matango
• Atragon
• Dogora
• Frankenstein Conquers the World
• War of the Gargantuas
• King Kong Escapes
• Latitude Zero
• Yog/Space Amoeba
• Vampire Doll
• Lake of Dracula
• Evil of Dracula
• Submersion of Japan
• ESPY
• Prophecies of Nostradamus
• HOUSE
• War in Space

So, I'm missing a lot. I also don't feel like it's really fair to put the straight horror films among the giant monsters or high sci-fi; they feel too separated to draw the kinds of comparisons people usually want when discussing what has, more or less, become Godzilla apocrypha.

On that, note, I want to say HOUSE by a ridiculously wide margin. It's a wonderful, insane, horrifying film that, unlike almost everything else from '60s and '70s Toho sci-fi outside the original Godzilla, I really can't want to be any better. I also never want to watch it alone.

But since I don't really feel it belongs on that list, H-Man is my next pick. It's deeply flawed, but it was my surprise standout of the three films on Sony's Toho sci-fi set. It's creepy, it's atmospheric, it's fun. It blows most of Honda's kaiju films out of the water.

I really, really want to see Matango at some point, along with the original Varan and The Mysterians, but that 3-pack is going for insane prices these days.

[Goji]

THE MYSTERIANS does not suck, sorry. The correct answer is that you didn't like it.

Something tells me you'll really like MATANGO, Rodan.

[Spuro]

Either WotG or FCTW. Both managed to blow me away when I first saw them.

[Goji]

That's nice. You're still presenting your opinion that "it really did suck", as absolute. THE MYSTERIANS isn't one of the golden era's absolute best, but it's anything but bad/dull.

[Goji]

Well, clearly, your definition of "bad" is a hell of a lot different than mine. The movie still has several *good* actors, some downright amazing music, and (what I feel are) satisfying SPX sequences. Obviously you don't feel the same way, and that's fine.

You want examples of "bad" Toho toku? FINAL WARS, REBIRTH OF MOTHRA 2, and SPACEGODZILLA. Those three are pretty much the bottle of the barrel. When you put THE MYSTERIANS alongside those, it looks like a fucking masterpiece.

GUNHED and BYE-BYE JUPITER aren't great either, but I see them more as failed experiments than "OMG dawg, this shit's so bad!!", and find them kind interesting, personally. I'd honestly take them over the other three.

[Goji]

Well, clearly, your definition of "bad" is a hell of a lot different than mine. The movie still has several *good* actors, some downright amazing music, and (what I feel are) satisfying SPX sequences. Obviously you don't feel the same way, and that's fine.

The characters are barely fleshed out, so the acting can only be as adequate as the character. They need more beef, and they aren't given it. The only character with any meat on him is Shirashi.

And I do enjoy the music, and the SPX is pretty good(Save for those crappy waves of water). But that alone doesn't save the film.

Fair enough. I can respect that. Thanks for the well constructed response.

You want examples of "bad" Toho toku? FINAL WARS, REBIRTH OF MOTHRA 2, and SPACEGODZILLA. Those three are pretty much the bottle of the barrel. When you put THE MYSTERIANS alongside those, it looks like a skreeonk masterpiece.

They ARE terrible, far worse than Mysterians. However, a comparison doesn't make Mysterians any better, it only looks like its better. Either way, it's still pretty weak.

Yeah, I was just citing Toho toku that I would label as strictly "bad", and MYSTERIANS just doesn't fit into that category for me.

You're still presenting your opinion... as absolute.

And you're not? How does this make any sense?

THE MYSTERIANS does not suck, sorry. The correct answer is that you didn't like it.

Oh weeeee, look who it is. The thorn in my side.

I wasn't presenting my opinion as absolute. When I said "it does not suck", I was poking fun at G'95's statement since he was already presenting HIS opinion as absolute. It's not my problem that this wasn't obvious to you. But, you know, you always have to pop in and saying something that may possibly/maybe/if you're lucky, make me look bad. Sorry to break it to you darling, but it didn't work.

To flat out say something "sucks" would imply that not only is this your opinion (and everyone else therefore must think it sucks) but is one shared my most people. THE MYSTERIANS isn't at the top of too many people's lists, but I have never heard anyone flat it call it "bad". Proclaiming that FINAL WARS is garbage is something that doesn't get a rise out of too many people because, well, most people do think it sucks. It's a popular opinion.

When someone points out a well-liked movie on a discussion board dedicated to said types of movies that they think "sucks",then their expected to explain why they feel that way. Godzilla 1995 did just that. You on the other hand, just wanted to snub your nose at me because you clearly have nothing better to do with your time.

In other words, fuck off, please and thank you.

[Gojira1963]

War of the Gargantuas, Rodan and then Mothra. I will be seeing King Kong Escapes for the firtst time this weekend!

[Goji]

I think you're letting his opinion and wording get the better of you.

Apparently.

I honestly think you're causing a stink for no apparent reason, so there's that.

We can always look forward to your non-contributions, Tyler.

[tymon]

^A stink? He pointed out an incredibly blatant contradiction in your post and called you out on it, without being too snarky, and was even less snarky in his follow-up. Why so defensive, dawg?

Anyways, now that I've seen Mothra it's definitely my favorite. I find the human element better than most G-films too, and the SFX are downright wonderful.

[Goji]

How exactly am I enforcing my opinion on anyone when I'm representing the popular opinion that it doesn't suck? Do you even understand what the fuck I'm saying, dawg?

[tymon]

How exactly am I enforcing my opinion on anyone when I'm representing the popular opinion that it doesn't suck? Do you even understand what the fuck I'm saying, dawg?

Then it's your wording that sucks, I suppose. "THE MYSTERIANS does not suck, sorry. The correct answer is that you didn't like it" implies some sort of enlightenment to the "objective goodness" of the movie, which of course doesn't exist with this or any other film, regardless of the film's objective accomplishments. Now, "THE MYSTERIANS does not suck according to the majority of the genre's fans, and for many good reasons" is probably closer to what you meant, I'm assuming.

[Goji]

*shrugs* Is this the part where I put on my dunce cap and sit in the corner for your amusement? I'm not really sure where exactly you two expect the conversation to go from here. I'll just leave it up to someone else to get things back on track.

[eabaker]

Mothra.

We back on topic now?

Good.

Mothra really sets the tone for the remainder of the Showa era, and do so with astonishing elegance and amssive entertainment value.

[Kaiser]

Mothra, WotG, and Rodan are all pretty close but I'd have to give the edge to Mothra since Frankie Sakai is awesome.