Angirus in Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla and Godzilla's Entry

[three]

I'm in the middle of watching this movie right now (oil refinery scene) and as usual, I'm enjoying one of my top five Godzilla movies. There are two thing running through my mind right now:

First, should Angirus (or any other kaiju) have had a bit more of a role or some more screen time in this movie? I don't mean big name kaiju, but someone like Rodan making an appearance to help out? If not him then Angirus (I feel) should've had some more screen time in this flick, at the very least jumping into the final battle to aid Godzilla once King Caesar went down. I figure it would be pretty neat, and while I love the pace, drama, and action in the film I believe it could've benefited from the added additional appearance if done right (though it borders on overkill, if done wrong).

Second, Godzilla at the refinery...I know that in Godzilla vs. Mothra Godzilla makes one of his more unique entries rising from the ground. I have always found it perplexing as to where, or how Godzilla was hiding in the warehouse in Godzilla vs. MechaGodzilla, even more so than the aforementioned Godzilla vs. Mothra. He's so big, and it's so weird to imagine that he would not only remain unnoticed but that he would wait in secret as if practicing guerrilla warfare of sorts to attack his new enemy.

Anyway, thems my thoughts now. Discuss as it pleases you, especially why and how he ended up in the warehouse.

[Hotrod93]

In all honesty, Anguirus was only in there to have an excuse to have a "Flash back" fight.

Also Why was Godzilla Sleeping in a cave?

It not really meant to be thought about considering it's a movie about giants fighting. So take it as plot needed Godzilla to be there for the battle.

If you want another answer, Godzilla may just be able to dig underground.

[eabaker]

I believe Teruyoshi Nakano has explained that the warehouse was on a dock, and Godzilla came from under the water, but that the angles they chose failed to make that clear.

[three]

I believe Teruyoshi Nakano has explained that the warehouse was on a dock, and Godzilla came from under the water, but that the angles they chose failed to make that clear.

that answers half of it. but it was the more vexing half so thank goodness. weird though, because you would think they'd try to make it clear what's going on.

[miguelnuva]

Question 1: Yes Angurius should been in both the final battle of Gvs MG and TOMG in my opinion. It makes MechaGodzilla more of a threat in both movies, evens the odds in TOMG and it would be nice to see Godzilla and his best friend go off into the sunset at the end of TOMG.

Question 2: I always felt Godzilla swam threw the dock and just went threw the warehouse for some reason as edbaker stated.

[three]

Thats some deep docking area for him to get that close to land without poking out till he needed too. Maybe he was crawling, trying to use the element of surprise.

this is the issue i have with it as well. he just springs up from god knows where and it looks like he contorted himself to fit in a small fishing warehouse. regardless of the intent or angle, this is to me right up there with his appearance out of the ground in the original Godzilla vs Mothra as one of the more bizarre entries.

[GodzillaFan1992]

If I recall. The role was written for Baragon, but because of how damage the suit was. They replaced him with Anguirus.

That would explain Anguirus being able to dig and his out-of-characterness considering no matter what he won't back down on a fight.

[three]

If I recall. The role was written for Baragon, but because of how damage the suit was. They replaced him with Anguirus.

That would explain Anguirus being able to dig and his out-of-characterness considering no matter what he won't back down on a fight.

well he had his jaw torn apart so i'm not shocked about his backing down. my thing is i'd rather have seen him return later in the film, even if that meant having him try again, taking on MG with Godzilla or KC or both.

he came, he saw, he broke his jaw, and that was it. as well...just a bit too little.

[GodzillaFan1992]

If I recall. The role was written for Baragon, but because of how damage the suit was. They replaced him with Anguirus.

That would explain Anguirus being able to dig and his out-of-characterness considering no matter what he won't back down on a fight.

well he had his jaw torn apart so i'm not shocked about his backing down. my thing is i'd rather have seen him return later in the film, even if that meant having him try again, taking on MG with Godzilla or KC or both.

he came, he saw, he broke his jaw, and that was it. as well...just a bit too little.

True good point.

I too would've like to have seen him in the end helping Godzilla and King Caesar.

I would've also like to have seen Anguirus and King Caesar return for TOMG helping Godzilla fight Mechagodzilla and Titanosaurus. That would've been cool.

[eabaker]

In terms of series continuity (I know, Showa series, so it doesn't really matter, but...), it makes more sense as Angilas than Baragon, anyway, since Angilas and Godzilla have an established partnership from DAM and (especially) Gigan, whereas I don't think he'd ever actually appeared in the same shot as Baragon in DAM (correct me if I'm wrong).

[three]

agree with you both. it would have been nice to see the tag team against Titanosaurus and MG, and Angirus does make more sense based on previous showa films.

and then it just falls apart in ToMG, with no Angirus, and no Baragon (sarcasm on the Baragon mention).

[miguelnuva]

Baragon being in the movie was a rumor, Angurius was already written to be in the film before MechaGodzilla.

[123go]

I think after Anguirus had his jaw broke, he was done, as he should have been. He's scrappy and written that way, but he's also a weaker Kaiju. Even though he's become very poular because of his never say die style of fighting doesn't mean his abilities change. He's written as a lesser Kaiju and thats what was seen on screen. King Seesar was a new Kaiju and alot of focus was given to him. While he proved to be slightly less than Godzilla, he was still tough enough to help G out in the end. If Anguirus came back too, that would cheapen things I think. Some kaiju are just greater than others. That's the cool thing about Toho. They generally keep the integrity of the characters in thier movies. (although Ghidorah seemed week in Godzilla vs. Gigan) But other than that....

[three]

I think after Anguirus had his jaw broke, he was done, as he should have been. He's scrappy and written that way, but he's also a weaker Kaiju. Even though he's become very poular because of his never say die style of fighting doesn't mean his abilities change. He's written as a lesser Kaiju and thats what was seen on screen. King Seesar was a new Kaiju and alot of focus was given to him. While he proved to be slightly less than Godzilla, he was still tough enough to help G out in the end. If Anguirus came back too, that would cheapen things I think. Some kaiju are just greater than others. That's the cool thing about Toho. They generally keep the integrity of the characters in thier movies. (although Ghidorah seemed week in Godzilla vs. Gigan) But other than that....

reminds me of vegeta. ya know, even when beaten vegeta doesn't quit either (examples include the final fight with kid buu). even if Angirus had come in battered and bruised, i think it would have been great to have him in that final battle AND/OR in the sequel, ToMG.

[ILL GREEN]

This is why I love japanese kaiju flicks because they always go against the grain of movies you are used to.

If you watched, Angurius jaw was' broken by MG. He couldn't fight and the jaw takes months to heal.

As for Godzilla, there are sink holes popping up all over the world all the time some going as 1200 ft deep. Off shore here in PR, there is a 2000 ft trench with caves. Some believe it to be the city of Atlantis. Godzilla easily could've entered a cave and ended up on Japan's industrial zone.

That was one of my favorite entries too.

[three]

^ yea, it takes a while to heal but would it not have been great if Angirus shows up and has that one moment where his involvement actually means something and isn't just to make Godzilla look better? i wouldn't have minded that.

[kpa]

I'm in the middle of watching this movie right now (oil refinery scene) and as usual, I'm enjoying one of my top five Godzilla movies. There are two thing running through my mind right now:

Many of the confusing/WTF moments in these films aren't explained in the stories, but make more sense if you know some of the background details about how the movies were were made. For example...

First, should Angirus (or any other kaiju) have had a bit more of a role or some more screen time in this movie? I don't mean big name kaiju, but someone like Rodan making an appearance to help out?

In the early 1970s the Japanese film industry was in terrible shape. Toho had laid off many of their employees, including much of their FX staff. With smaller budgets and fewer personnel, the Godzilla film crews had to cut costs. One way they did that was to stop using monsters like Rodan and Mothra that required big teams of wire technicians to control the wings and limbs... flying monsters in the 1970s (Gigan, Mechagodzilla, etc) are generally portrayed by stiff models that don't have flapping wings. King Ghidorah was brought back for GIGAN in 1972, but the new footage shot was very restrained compared to the stock footage from the 1960s and the new flying scenes used another stiff model. In the mid-1970s, producer Tomoyuki Tanaka said Ghidorah wouldn't be used again because he was too expensive.

And that has a lot to do with Angilas appearing so much in the 1970s films. Toho had the new suit made for DAM, and all it need was minimal wirework to control the tail so Angilas was much cheaper and easier to use than other monsters. So the real world conditions had an impact on the fictional world shown in the films.

Also, Toho considers Rodan one of their "Big Five" kaiju, alongside Godzilla, Mothra, King Ghidorah and Mechagodzilla so he is a "big name kaiju". The original RODAN was a big hit in the US and internationally, and the monster co-starred in three movies in the 1960s. Rodan hasn't been used much in the newer films, but he's still one of the few monsters to appear in all three Godzilla series.

If not him then Angirus (I feel) should've had some more screen time in this flick, at the very least jumping into the final battle to aid Godzilla once King Caesar went down.

I think the idea was to show early on that Mechagodzilla was a serious threat by having him beat Angilas so badly that the monster -- known for being a scrapper -- ran for his life. Having Angilas return for a rematch would have undermined that.

I also don't think he should have been used in TOMG since the point was to have Godzilla -- who needed help to defeat Mechagodzilla before -- was now alone against MG and a second foe.

Second, Godzilla at the refinery...I know that in Godzilla vs. Mothra Godzilla makes one of his more unique entries rising from the ground. I have always found it perplexing as to where, or how Godzilla was hiding in the warehouse in Godzilla vs. MechaGodzilla, even more so than the aforementioned Godzilla vs. Mothra. He's so big, and it's so weird to imagine that he would not only remain unnoticed but that he would wait in secret as if practicing guerrilla warfare of sorts to attack his new enemy.

Eabaker explained it. Nakano also said the filmmakers were having a hard time thinking up new ways of introducing Godzilla in movie after movie, so sometimes they just decided to surprise the audience rather than be completely logical.

this is to me right up there with his appearance out of the ground in the original Godzilla vs Mothra as one of the more bizarre entries.

I never thought Godzilla's entrance in MvsG was bizarre. The movie opens with a typhoon, then cuts to efforts to drain the water from a coastal flood plain filled with debris (including a piece of Godzilla's skin floating in the wreckage). Days later, Godzilla later emerges from this same location... the pieces are all there to explain that Godzilla was washed ashore and buried by the storm, then woke up and moved on.

[three]

as neat as the background is, you're welcome to drop in your two cents or opinions on it rather than giving the facts (eabaker coverd it all well and good, but since that's been done i figure there's no real reason to keep answering the same question ya know?). i mean yea i think most people get that Angirus showed up to make everyone later look good, but would you personally have preferred more screen time for him/a return to the battlefield?

as for the Rodan thing...i don't consider him a big name, nobody outside this fandom really knows the kaiju, and he's had nothing going for him since the Ghidorah films in the 60s, so it would be safe to say adding him wouldn't have been some huge bombshell.

[eabaker]

as for the Rodan thing...i don't consider him a big name, nobody outside this fandom really knows the kaiju, and he's had nothing going for him since the Ghidorah films in the 60s, so it would be safe to say adding him wouldn't have been some huge bombshell.

While that may be true to some degree now, in this country, it certainly was not the case at the time. As kpa pointed out, Rodan was a big hit in the US. The Aurora model of Rodan was one of the only kaiju figures made available to American kids for a long time, and the same can be said of the later Shogun Warriors Rodan. Also, Rodan sits alongside Godzilla and Mothra as the Toho kaiju most often name-dropped in mainstream American television.

I can't say much about relative popular awareness of specific kaiju in Japan, I'm afraid.

[three]

huh. didn't know all that. axe that from the original set of ideas then -- limit it to just Angirus.